The World’s Greatest Formulator, Shawn Wells joins the show to shed light on the dark sides of the supplement industry. I ask Shawn to share his top tips on selecting supplements so you guys don't need to waste your money anymore. Shawn talks about his personal experience with things like chronic fatigue syndrome, Epstein-Barr, fibromyalgia, depression, insomnia, obesity, and he talks openly about psychedelics.
Shawn Wells, MPH, LDN, RD, CISSN, FISSN is a product formulator and expert in the fields of performance nutrition, longevity, fitness and supplementation. He earned his master’s degree from UNC-Chapel Hill, where he studied nutritional biochemistry with a minor in exercise science. Shawn is a Registered Dietitian with a decade of experience as a Chief Clinical Dietitian in hospitals and skilled nursing facilities. He is also a Certified Sports Nutritionist and has worked with celebrity clients and professional athletes.
On the road to being dubbed “The World’s Greatest Formulator”, Biohacktivitst, and Keto Authority, Shawn faced and overcame significant obstacles with his own health—weight issues, depression, autoimmune conditions (Epstein-Barr, Fibromyalgia, and Chronic Fatigue Syndrome), two cervical discs replacements, and a pituitary adenoma, which is a type of brain tumor. They say everything happens for a reason, and in Shawn’s case, his health problems led him down a winding path that required him to find science-based solutions, and they sparked his personal passion for biohacking.
[4:40] What has 2020 changed?
[11:01] The origin story of the world's greatest formulator
[23:10] Reaching the state of homeostasis
[30:31] Misunderstandings about plant medicine and psychedelics
[44:05] Behind the scenes of the Supplements Industry
[53:03] Using Apple cider vinegar
[57:30] Discovering potential formulation
[1:04:34] Nootropics and cognitive enhancers
[1:15:30] The ENERGY Formula
Boomer Anderson: [00:00:00]Welcome to decoding superhuman. This show is a deep dive into obsessions withhealth performance, and how to elevate the human experience. I explore thelatest tools, science and technology with experts in various fields of humanoptimization. This is your host, boomer Anderson enjoy the journey.
All right. The supplement industry is just absolutelytotally crazy. You buy something thinking that it's going to help you. Andoftentimes the ingredients don't match what's on the label. The effects are notthe same as what is claimed, and frankly, it can be just a waste of money. So,what do you do as a consumer?
Because you don't have the time, like I do to just flipthrough all of research, ask all the questions, et cetera. How do you reallyget to the point? Well, my guest today is here to really shed some light onthat. His name is Shawn Wells and Sean is a friend through many other friends.Thank you, Dasha.
Maximov for the introduction here, but he's formulated over500 supplements, foods, beverages, and cosmeceuticals, and patented over 10novel ingredients. He's now known as the ingredient tologist, which is just ascientist for ingredients. And he's formerly a chief clinical dietician withover a decade of clinical experience.
What I like about this conversation is within the firstseveral minutes of the conversation and in his book, actually, you get. All ofthe real answers you need to identify the supplements that are right for you.The brands that have decades of loyalty and really have lived up to what's onthe label, Sean sheds light on his personal experience with things like chronicfatigue syndrome, Epstein-Barr fibromyalgia, depression, insomnia, obesity, andso much more.
We get into psychedelics and how really 2020 was a blessingfor both Sean and I, in terms of personal discovery, you're going to want tocheck out his book, which we'll link to in the show notes, but the really theshow notes for this one email@example.com slash Sean that's S H a w N.
Since we're having to about supplements, thought it might beuseful to talk about transcriptions. Over a year ago, we came out with bluecanteen and blue canteen has served the TRO belly and very, very well givingyou guys access to focus for four to six hours. You get flow States, easier,verbal fluency.
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Let's get on with my conversation with Sean, Sean Wells foras many mutual connections as we have. This is a, this is a pleasure. Justgetting to have this conversation. Thank you for joining us.
Shawn Wells: [00:03:57]Thank you for having me. I'm excited as well. It's it is funny that you have somany friends in common and, uh, people that I consider not just knowledgeable,but really good human beings.
And they all think highly of you. And I think they thinkhighly of me. So it's, uh, I think it's going to be a great friendship and I'mlooking forward to getting to know you.
Boomer Anderson: [00:04:20]Yeah, absolutely. More than just this conversation, for sure. So as a personwho also travels quite a bit, um, I have to ask what has 2020 meant for you?
Because I read somewhere that actually you have this in yourbook. You're scheduled to travel 300 days a year, which is a lot, my friend. Sowhat did 2020 turnout like for
Shawn Wells: [00:04:45]you? Yeah, um, you know, the years prior, uh, it was, uh, it was a hundred daysand then it became 200 days and then 2020 was supposed to be 300 days and I waschasing achievement.
Uh, I have all the credentials and letters after my name andI was trying to get into bigger and better masterminds. I was trying to get onbigger and better stages, bigger and better podcasts. And there's nothinginherently wrong about trying to level up to some degree. But, uh, I think myintentions behind it were not true to myself all the time.
You know, I I've, I feel like I was searching for loveoutwardly by accomplishment and not realizing that. I can get love for free,but I just, you know, putting the right people around me and, and just openingup and connecting with the relationships. So I was pushing really hard. Uh,it's called in, in, uh, in Peru, they talk about the, uh, Houma, the condor andthe snake and these different energies.
And the Puma is like that drive for achievements that driveto accomplish. And the snake is like, uh, as a grounded energy it's sheddingits transition. Um, and then the condor is like the strategic, you know, likeoversight, like, you know, view from above kind of thing. And you have to takeon different energies at different points in your life.
There isn't one that's inherently better than the other, butI was definitely stuck in what they even called wounded Puma. Which a lot ofentrepreneurs are, you know, some of our drive to accomplish comes from traumaand insecurity and we accomplish amazing things. And, you know, we outworkother people.
We, we have incredible drive, you know, 80, a hundred hourwork weeks, whatever build businesses, acquire wealth, employ a lot of people,you know, so many entrepreneurs I know are so amazing, you know, at, at justraw accomplishment, it's incredible to watch, but there's a pain that'sunderlying and there's a desire to keep working to almost cover it up.
And I was so blessed that 2020 allowed me to really take amassive step back and go from wounded Puma to. A snake when I was in thesejourneys that I was doing quite a bit, we can talk about. And then, and thenthe condor to really, you know, look at what is serving me. Like what, what arethese things are actually lighting me up.
I was so busy that anyone would say, uh, you want to do thespeaking engagement you want to do like this TV show, do this thing. Like, yes,if it's a thing and I've got an open. Yes. And I started looking at it and I'mlike, you know, TV thing was cool for like my sizzle reel, but a three minute,you know, blurb of like me saying yes, ketos.
Cool. All right. Back to you, Bob, you know? And it's like,why did I just did it? You know, it's like, and I love like, I love going deepon podcasts. And I started like, thinking about what, what actually lights meup. What does serve me. And I really started putting boundaries around things,getting rid of things.
I had FOMO around, I was getting scientific advisory boardrequests all the time and just yes, yes, yes, yes. And a lot of them, I justdidn't like it. I didn't like the energy, the people I didn't, but I wasworried. I was worried. I might miss out on something and it was so good goinginto 2020 and doing journeys, putting mentors around me, mentoring others, uh,getting, uh, you know, a couple of therapists and, you know, taking this thistime to really just do a deep dive into myself.
And it was a game changer for me. And it really changed theshape of the book I was writing. It led to me, rewriting it several times, uh,now even rerecording it. Uh, but it's, it's now something I'm more proud of.I'm in a position now where I'm very, very much. At ease. I feel like, uh, Ican manifest instead of like clawing for things scraping and reaching and likedesiring, and I'm going to show them to now, it's like, I am, would you like tojoin me?
And it's a very different energy. And, uh, and I'm so proudthat I got to move through that. And there's no way I would have done thatunless it was a pandemic that stopped everything. Unless I had like, you know,some massive health situation, like, you know, I got cancer, heart attack, or,you know, I'm so blessed that it was not that, and that this has happened.
And it just so, so thankful, you know, obviously I don'tlike the idea of, of the negative repercussions of the pandemic, but of what itallowed me to do in 2020 was, was massive, like a full shift. So yes, it wasamazing.
Boomer Anderson: [00:10:20]And I think there's a lot of people and I was actually surprised at this, butwhen I started pulling people, um, who have a similar lifestyle traveling allthe time, uh, always looking at achievement, the next promotion, the nextraise, whatever it is, uh, there's a lot of people that saw 2020 in that way.
And myself included, you know, I've never spent more thanthree weeks in the same city since I was probably 25 years old. Uh, and so thiswas quite an enlightening period for myself as well. Now I want to go at onepoint you made there was, and I do find this as a very common thing amongentrepreneurs is that there's this desire to achieve around, covering up eithertrauma or past experiences, desire to prove people wrong in your particularsituation.
If you're open to going down this route, Do you mind justsetting the stage for us in terms of what kind of led to Sean Wells? Theworld's greatest formulator.
Shawn Wells: [00:11:25]Yeah. And you're right. And when I've been in these mastermind circles, uh,when you're really getting raw with, with especially men, male entrepreneurs,um, there's a lot of pain there and we're taught to suppress it.
You're a bitch. If you cry right here, you're a woosie. Ifyou cry, if you show any weakness, especially in this circle, like where it'slike, you know, we're taught to hustle and grind, you don't show weakness, yougrind, you grind your way through it, through the pain. That's how you earnyour badge. That's what I was taught.
And that's what my father was taught. And so it was a verydisciplined, difficult childhood. Um, but it's Nina. It's not, it's not hisfault either. You know, it's, it's, that's what his dad was incredibly tough onhim. And it's just one of those things that we're taught as men and as humanbeings to just be tough, tough it out, stick it out, grind it out, you know,don't cry.
Let's go, come on, you know, push through it. And that'swhat I was doing. I was grinding away. And if you think about grinding andpieces breaking off and heat, and you know, you breaking down your heads down,you're miserable. Just keep pushing through it. And this is the worst adviceever hustle. Yes. Hustle.
Sure. There's times to be in that sympathetic nervous systemmode where you, you hustle for it. Absolutely. But grind. No, no, I don't thinkso. I don't, I don't think that's the case. Like. One of the greatest aspectsof self-love to me that I've learned is setting boundaries. And I putboundaries around things that are energy draining to me and grinding is mostcertainly energy draining.
And I will also say that you're quite often, I believe inthe right place, right time all the time, but your head's down. You're just notseeing it. Your head's down. You're tired. You're not thriving. You're notconnecting with the world around you. You're not connecting with theseopportunities that are right there.
I don't know if that's so much that you're just manifestingit as it is. Like you're, you're connecting and you're heads up and you're orwhere, you know, like it's one of those things that I'm kind of like learningmy way through, but, you know, going back to my childhood, uh, I was alsooverweight. I was bullied.
Uh, I considered suicide quite often. Um, you know, I justwas a kid that would come home and, and, you know, eat sugar cereal and watchTV and play video games and just, you know, try and hide away. And, uh, andthen, you know, into college, like, I, I, I got anorexic. I went from like 300pounds at six foot, two to 150 pounds.
What was that,
Boomer Anderson: [00:14:36]Trent? What caused that transition? Was it just sort of like a, Hey, I need tolose this weight and then it became the extreme,
Shawn Wells: [00:14:42]it was just powerful in college. My night I had like maybe three friends and Ifelt very alone and, uh, and they weren't even, you know, deep friendships.And, uh, I just felt like I was dangling on like a, a little cord out in space.
Boomer Anderson: [00:15:01]This is at Babson, right?
Shawn Wells: [00:15:02]Yeah. And, uh, and I, yeah, I started losing weight and that was good. Andthen, uh, you had mentioned in my book, I talk about this doctor that thatreally changed my perspective. Uh, but it was around that time that I was likeworking out using supplements and I was getting great change, but it, it endedup going almost in a, in a really unhealthy direction, like where I wasweighing myself, like right after I peed, you know, and it's just, I don't wantthem to get like, as amazing created as I possibly could, because I just thoughtfat was, was the worst thing ever.
And I hated my body. And so I went that other direction.There was body dysmorphia. Yeah. And then I, and then I bounced back and hadlike, A lot of working out like five, six days a week and four hours a day andyou know, two times a day and all of the supplements. And I got orthorexic, youknow, as soon as I was done working out, I'm going got a Bolick I've I've gotto like eat protein immediately.
This is the window, you know, the whole thing. Um, and sothere was a long period of my life that I had a lot of body dysmorphia andself-loathing and, um, but yeah, so I did meet a doctor, uh, when I was abouthalfway through at Babson, a business specialty school. And, uh, and he changedmy life path. I was telling him about supplements and working out, and then Iwas getting all these benefits and I was like super passionate about it.
And he looked at me and he's like, Is there anybody? And Iwas like, yeah, of course. And you know, at this time I didn't have exposure tolike entrepreneurs and all these people online, accomplishing all these things.I didn't know the Oprah's and, and Tony Robbins and all these people. I justlike, for me, like a doctor was like, wow.
And so he drove this lifeline for me. Like I was 20 at thetime and he drew it out to 80 and he said, why not be happy between here andhere? He could tell like that the business thing was what I was doing, youknow, to please, my parents are doing to please the world. And like this stuffreally interested me and lit me up.
And for him as a doctor that has no responsibility to saythat to me, for him to do that for me was, was life-changing. And, and it wassomeone that at that time, like I would. Take their, their thoughts andopinions very seriously, because I looked at him as super successful andaccomplished. And that, that really opened the door for me to say, I can go to,like, I literally, like, I don't have to stay on this path.
Like everyone else was telling me that it was stupid. Thatif I went back to school, you just need to go get a job, you know, get outthere and work. But this guy like kind of gave me permission to go pursue whatwas now my passion and my dream. And, uh, and that allowed me to become all thethings that I've become.
So it's one of those things that like, there would be noquote, unquote world's greatest formulator, the book that I have or all thepeople I've impacted or us talk in this podcast, without that one guy going outof his way. To tell me something that changed my life like that. I just, I lookat that as so profound and it impacts me all the time when I think back on it,that I can have that impact on someone, whether they realize it now or not, orwhether I realize it now or not, my words, and my actions can greatly change someone'slife have that's that's powerful for me.
Boomer Anderson: [00:18:39]I mean, it's, it sounds incredibly powerful in general. It's also, uh, Iimagine at the time and correct me if I'm wrong here, Sean is probably quiteterrifying because you're breaking a barrier and it sounds like we may have hadsimilar upbringings in terms of what parents wanted for us and breaking thatbarrier can be very, very challenging.
Uh, was the doctor involved in some of the, like at leasthelping you through those conversations with some of the key people in yourlife? Or did you just kind of, you know, bull in the China shop style, gothrough it.
Shawn Wells: [00:19:13]Yeah. Uh, yeah, more, the, more of the bull in the China shop thing, I guess.Um, and that's how I was like, I think I just, and the same with like myweight, like you were talking about before, I just hit this point where I wasso disgusted with myself.
And I think I took so many hateful comments about design wasnot only overweight, but I have a guy named fat distribution, uh, which, youknow, big butt basically, and big legs. And so for that, I got attacked a lotand I, and girls made fun of me a lot and the guys would laugh about it a lot.And it just hit a point where it's like, it was unhealthy, uh, what I wasthinking about myself, but it led to pretty radical change, um, in a very shortperiod of time.
And I have the power to do that. Like that's like. You know,when we're talking about the entrepreneur drive, it's very similar. Like I willI'll work out last. I'll push just about anyone, but it can, you know, there'stimes when that's, that's a powerful skill. And then there's times that that's,you know, kind of your undoing and it was very unhealthy for me.
And it ended up leading to a lot of health issues, me whereI had autoimmune issues with Epstein bar fibromyalgia, chronic fatigue.Hasimoto's, couldn't get out of bed for six months. Wow. Pain and inflammation.And I, again, thought of suicide because I thought my life was over all this studying.And that was, this was while I was getting my master's at chapel Hill innutrition, biochemistry.
Um, I thought all this work, all this effort, all thesacrifices, it's all for nothing. I'm just going to spend my life in bed andpain and not able to function. Um, and then that led me to keto and a bunch ofother things that really helped me. And you'll see that like all these peoplethat are really good at what they do, there's like some real reasons behind it.
There's some real passion behind it. And there was otherpoints in my life. It was about eight years ago that I got a brain tumor. Andagain, at the same time, I was like at diamond ties, I was working 80 hours aweek. I was getting out of my good habits because it was night and day. We werepushing the, sell the company.
We eventually did sell it in three years to post for $425million. And so that the air around diamond ties wasn't just work, work, work.It's like push, push, push for this goal. And that sucked the life out of metoo. I mean, I, again, accomplished great things, but was not healthy. And thenI got a brain tumor and, you know, that's where each point like, I've, I'velearned to like, wait, I need to stop.
I need to reevaluate. And so it just seems like every nowand then in my life, there's like something that my body is saying like, stop.Like, we need to look at this, like, you know, all these things to do, and youcan learn all these things. So you can put the right experts around you. Let's,let's reimagine what your life looks like.
And that's been very helpful to me to, to have those momentsto stop. And now I'm very appreciative of my body. Most of my life I've hatedmy body. And now I'm actually thankful to my body that despite me hating it andwith all the pushing I did and driving and accomplishment, I did that. Itlasted through all that, and it's now served me.
And now I'm just thankful that it's here that had survivedall that hell that I put it through mentally and physically. That's incredible.
Boomer Anderson: [00:22:57]So it seems like over the course of life, you had a number of signals that saylike, Hey, this bull in the China shop at it. And you know, going back to thatmetaphor is not the right approach, but similar to many people in thisentrepreneurial position, you kind of rerock deal with the signal at hand andthen almost re-engaged the bowl.
Um, w whether it be body dysmorphia or just sort of the, uh,the constant foot on the gas pedal, what, and you mentioned journeys earlier,so I'm happy to go down that if you feel like this is the right time, but whatkind of got you to this state of homeostasis, uh, for lack of a better word,where you got more comfortable with the body fat distribution, I certainly havesomething similar, um, big, big thighs for instance, but what got you morecomfortable?
With just Shawn Wells as a person.
Shawn Wells: [00:24:01]I think when I was able to grant myself some grace in the plant medicine space,but to when I granted myself accomplishment, achievement, and I'm proud of meinstead of searching for all these people that I was wanted to give me thataccolade, especially my father. Uh, there was one moment I went into with thisreally great hypnotherapist.
He works with like very elite, uh, poker players. Uh, hisname is Elliot RO and I
Boomer Anderson: [00:24:38]have a connection to Elliot. So I'm familiar with his work. Yeah,
Shawn Wells: [00:24:42]so he, he did some regression with me and took me back to a moment that was,you know, a traumatic argument, uh, in my childhood. And. And he had me, youknow, I'm sure you've heard of like the, you know, can you hug that, that childthey're like, that's you right.
And that was powerful. I mean, that makes sense. You'veprobably heard that before. I was already very emotional at that point. Andthen he said, what does that child think about you? And that's when I had likea full on breakdown and, and that child was in awe of me and so proud of me andthat to give myself that I think I, you know, for 40 some years I'd been drivingfor that to allow myself that was, was powerful.
And that's when I stopped worrying about. The things, theoutward things, the aesthetics, the, you know, what people think of me, I'mjust proud of me and like the desire to please other people started fadingaway. And then in the plant medicines phase, it was similar to my, my firstjourney, uh, was with mostly people, I didn't know, maybe about 20 people.
And, um, but it was a very, it was, it was, uh, it's veryimportant that you create like a safe container, uh, you know, the whole setand setting thing. Like you need to go in with the right mindset. You need tohave people that are. Creating the right setting and to have a desire to helpyou set intentions and then do integration afterwards.
But it's also needs to be a safe container that you feelcomfortable in, that you can be seen in that you can be vulnerable and you needto trust the facilitators that they have your best interest in heart. And thenthat you are taking the right plant medicine and the right amount at the righttime.
And they know your medical history, they know your emotionalhistory and all this stuff. And so they can guide that. And with me, theystarted me slow and I had like kind of two REApps, you know, during the nightfor, uh, silicide oven, not allowed me, you know, as someone who wasn'texperienced to kind of slowly, you know, move into it and not feel overwhelmed.
And what matters is that you. Lean into the medicine thatyou like. It's very easy that you can actually like lean out, not have it takeany effect unless you take massive hero doses that just overwhelmed. Yeah. So Iliked being able to kind of lean in and one of the really cool things is, youknow, I've been all these masterminds, like I said, and leveling up and people,you know, I'm trying to like talk to the people that I think are like a levelabove me.
And then there's of course, people that are trying to talkto me that think I'm a level up and, and it's like this, you know, what canthey do for me? What am I doing for them? Kind of exchanges that you'restarting to think in this mindset when I was in this room and everyone was justloving, they didn't know who I was and people gravitated to me.
And I was able to just access like this full on childlike,playful self. And have people just interacted me and do cuddle puddles and allthis stuff. And, and I realized that, like that, that was the moment that Irealized that love is free. Love is here. Like I don't have to go out andachieve and earn it.
It's right here. If I want it, these people don't even knowme and they're spending time with me because they love me because they like whoI am. Mike, I can, I can have this anytime I want this. And I'm spending allthis time, money, energy, like trying to go get this. You don't realize that'swhat you're trying to do.
That's what you're trying to do. Because this thing, thislove like is worth more than the cars and houses and status and all the shit.It's what you really want in your heart of hearts is to be appreciated and togive love and to feel love from yourself and others. And so that was, that wasso powerful for me.
And then to also realize in that, in this space, that thenight that I can be anything I want right now, if I want to just stop being a formulatorand just go travel the mountains, I can go do that. I mean, there'srepercussions for that, but I could just go do that. And there was a freedom inthat, just realizing that, that I'm not like on like a set path that kind oflike that doctor gave for me.
I gave it to myself that night and the plant medicine that Ican be anything I want. And if I keep wanting to change and kind of go downthis psychedelic path and enlighten people that way, and that's what I'm goingto do, like whatever lights me up and interests me and those people that areinterested in me will follow me or I'll get new people that are interested inthis new thing I'm in.
And I just paid to chase my passions and find the thingsthat light me up and not worry about pleasing everyone. It's very
Boomer Anderson: [00:30:11]powerful. Um, Sean, I think there's something that we should, we should touchon around psychedelics because you know, I've certainly, I've talked openlyabout my use of them in the past, and I think it's much as it sounds with youaccelerated my own personal growth.
What do you think is most misunderstood about, um, some ofthese journeys, plant medicine psychedelics in general and what do you thinkpeople out there should know about them? Um, even before embarking or evendoing their own research? Medicinal mushrooms have played a significant role inboosting my immunity in recent years, but I'm a person who.
Hasn't really used mushrooms. Most of my life. In fact, whenI was in sixth grade biology, I had an allergic reaction to them and avoidedthem largely until I was forced to eat them at client dinners in the financeworld. But now I incorporate mushrooms like chaga, Rishi, and even lion's maneinto my every day routines.
And what company do I trust most in those medicinal mushroomrealms? Well, it's the guys over at Kappa health had Eric Pearl on the showbefore you've actually seen me talk to him again on Instagram too, but he is afantastic wealth of knowledge and the dedication to the science that these guyshave is quite impressive.
Head on over to Kappa health.com. It's K a P a H E L T h.comand use the code boomer for a 10% discount. Let's get on with the show,
Shawn Wells: [00:32:01]the difference between these plant medicines that can be teachers and just whatpeople consider as like recreational addictive drugs that are just euphoria inand of themselves or a rushed. Um, this is very different from that. Like theseplant medicines I've used, I would not say are addictive, especially in the waythat I've used them.
When I, when I go into a container and again, I havefacilitators, I don't, I, I do not do these things really on my own at thispoint yet, whilst I, I think I will at some point, but I need to feelcomfortable as myself to be a facilitator for others, that I can do that formyself. So I am being facilitated in a way where I'm learning.
My reaction in this space, learning how to maneuver in thisspace. And these, these are tools, they're all tools. I wouldn't say largely tohelp you tap into higher self and break down, uh, ego constructs. There's a lotof powerful constructs that we build over time, uh, that help us survive, butthey do not help us thrive.
Uh, like I was talking about before, like it helps protectus from, you know, being wounded, these stories and these realities quote,unquote, that we, that we take on these constructs or in, in the idea of ByronKatie, it's the stories or in the idea of Don Miguel Ruiz. It's the agreementsthat we're making over time.
Right? So it's that it's, it's peeling those away. And Istopped feeling one of the biggest, most powerful learnings for me too, duringplant medicine is that I always felt like I was broken and I feel likebiohacking, there's almost like a insinuation that you are broken like that youneed to fix it. You need to hack it.
You know, quick time let's find the shortcut, you know,there's on one hand, there's that quick fix of biohacking. On the other hand,there's the, there's the, there's the grinding it out for years and suffering.And we love these mindsets, but in the middle, there's like a joy, a peace, acenteredness of you are not broken.
You were born perfect and beautiful. And over time we'vebuilt some of these constructs that we just need to break down and move away.Just like we get the car polished and the car looks great. Like we just need toclean it up from time to time. And I think the ego needs a reset from time totime, they call it like ego death.
Sometimes when you're in some of the more intense journeys,really see past all that stuff. And you forgive you, forgive others, youforgive yourself, you have a clear view of what your truth is. So much of ouranger and frustration that we're, that we're feeling for other people is trulywith ourselves because we're not aligned.
We're not in alignment with our truth and that upsets us,but that's very deep within, and there's a bunch of ego construct stuff that'stelling you. It's all about these people around you. They're screwing with you.They're fucking you over there. Jerks. Why would they do this to me? You didn'tset up the ground rules.
You didn't lay out the communication. You weren't real withyourself. You didn't put the right people around you. You didn't take the timeto think this through. Who are you mad with? You're mad with yourself. Andyou're just projecting it out. You have that resentment outwards, and it'sbecause you have so much expectations and expectations create resentment.
You really should go through life with a whole lot lessexpectations. Have it like a creative playful heart and say like, you know, theuniverse is working for me. Let's see what happens here. Uh, but that's,that's, uh, you know, the, the biggest learning and with a plant medicine,like, again, it's just so key to have really good facilitators.
You go in and you set intentions. You say, this is my planfor what I'm going to get out of this journey. I've been working through thisand I would like to get some answers to this. And it helps me set thatintention. And just like in everyday life, like if you're working on yourgratitude journal or, you know, whatever it is, like make a plan for the dayand, you know, by, by and large you'll achieve it.
And then on the other side of your journey, you. Haveintegration and that integration not only takes place that day with thosefacilitators who are very skilled at helping you through that, like, what doesthis mean? What is it that you learned, but like, how do you apply to your lifein the real world for the next coming days, months, and years for real change.
So that it isn't just an escape. It isn't just, I'm tryingto get away from my real life. If you're around the right people, these becomepowerful tools, but it depends how you use them. And yeah, we're just listeningto a led Zeppelin album in the seventies, you know, maybe you just be like, Heyman, cool.
Like, you know, this music's great, you know, have that kindof experience. But with the right intentions in the right environment with, uh,with focus facilitators, it can be extremely different and very powerful forhelping initiate change and just break down those barriers like with MTMA, youknow, it started with couples actually here in Dallas.
Um, you know, helping them with, uh, their marriages andjust having that clarity between, um, that honest love between them breakingdown those constructs so that they can talk in a real way. And that's, that'swhere these medicines are so profound. And we're, we're seeing that. I mean,these guys, you know, with maps, like, uh, that works for them DMA, you'reseeing people in breathe, maybe six sex sessions, max moving through verytraumatic PTSD, like just past it.
And you don't see that with traditional medicines. This isa, this is a very different thing.
Boomer Anderson: [00:38:18]Yeah. I'm very excited as a person who has done a number of psychedelicjourneys, um, and seeing the benefits of myself. I'm very excited that as. Asyou mentioned sort of phase three of them, DME trials gets passed hopefullyvery soon, uh, through the FDA, just what that means for the rest of the world.
Coming back to these journeys and you hinted at theintegration part, but for me and Sean, I'd love to hear your viewpoint here.Like the psychedelic journey itself shows me what's possible, but if I do nothingon the backend, it's almost hard to implement what, what I saw in thatexperience. I would love to hear if you feel the same way and also what you dopersonally, uh, in those integration steps afterwards.
Shawn Wells: [00:39:13]Yeah. That's where, uh, I did one Clara agentic as it was called experience.Um, And in Nashville, uh, where they use 20 different, uh, plant medicines. Andit's wow. That sets in for six hours here, you're wearing a mindful that'scalled and listening to the journey music, and you just channel stuff to your,from your higher self.
And it's just recorded. And what I loved with this was, youknow, again, I was forgiving people. I was coming up with business ideas forgiving myself, saying, Sean, you kick ass. I love you. Like all this. It wasjust beautiful to just be in that space. And it wasn't, it was less altered andit was just more enlightenment.
It was a very interesting experience. It was very differentthan other medicines I've used. And, um, I had to go back and listen to myself.For these six hours and then transcribe it myself. Of course I could have usedsome app, like, you know, Otter, Google recorder, whatever, like to just, youknow, translate it and transcribe it.
But I was supposed to do it myself and make notes and hearmy own voice. It was so powerful to do that, to listen to your own voice,because so much of like in our lives, our voice is, is a negative voice, youknow, the inner critic and you know, the imposter syndrome. And if anyonetalked to you, like you talked to you, you wouldn't be their friend, right?
Like it's, we're harsh or harsh. So to hear like your voicebe so beautiful, so loving to give yourself so much grace it's, it'stranscendent. It's very powerful to hear that. And it shifts you, but to takethese notes and say, you know, here's what I've been saying. So I'm going toapply it. Like I need to put these things in action.
Is, this is my higher self saying, this is what I need. Thisis what I need to feel loved to feel positive energy, to feel the field lit up.So I'm going to start taking steps towards these things, and I'm going to startremoving some of the things that are blocks for that. And it's just looking atthese items on a daily basis and saying, how can I move closer to these?
And then also checking in with someone like yourfacilitator, you know, monthly or whatever it is and saying, here's where I'mat. Yeah. What do you think? And obviously they're very skilled at working withpeople and, and helping them move in those directions, even through things thatseem traumatic and very difficult to get out of, you can feel trapped a lot inyour life.
Like you feel like, like I was saying before thateverything's on rails and you can't escape and it's not true. And you work witha good facilitator and you work with yourself. And break down the, the, theconstructs, you see that you have way more freedom than you're allowingyourself, and you see that you have way more love than you're allowingyourself, but coming in and going out.
And so that's, that can be massive and change. I will say,like, uh, gains momentum over time. Like things just start building. Like onceyou get that solid foundation, they start building and then you startfacilitating for others to some degree, like, you know, I started a mastermindgroup with me and five other friends and, uh, and that just kind of came out ofall of this.
Like now I, you know, check with, check with them daily onsignal. And then we do like a once a week zoom and we're helping each other outholding each other accountable. A lot of this just came from that, that space.And now this is helping my growth further, you know,
Boomer Anderson: [00:42:59]amazing. Shawn, if it's okay with you. I want to talk a little bit, because upto this point, I've kind of teased people with the supplement at a sort oftopic, but I want to go a little bit into that and then get into the book, uh,in a little later.
But when it comes to supplements, I think there's a lot ofpeople that are both skeptics, but also there's a lot of, um, shall we saydodgy people in the field? And I'm just kind of curious, you know, as somebodywho's very much in this field and you formulated, I think over a hundreddifferent supplements, is that right?
Shawn Wells: [00:43:43]500,
Boomer Anderson: [00:43:45]500 shit. I was, I was a little off by five X, but, uh, you know, what, whatkind of percentage of supplements out there just don't. Live up to what theysay or set another way. Don't have the, even the ingredients that they, theyadvertise them in the
Shawn Wells: [00:44:03]box. At one point, I would say it was 90%, maybe 10 years ago.
I would say that there's been a trend towards more testing,more transparency, more, um, straightforward, labeling a movement away fromproprietary blends, which I'm just a huge, uh,
Boomer Anderson: [00:44:28]I don't know. I laughed because that was one of your bullet points in the bookand
Shawn Wells: [00:44:31]yeah. Yeah. I, I, I can't stand them. Um, but I would say now it's maybe 70,75% are not trustable, but there's, there are really good brands out there thatare consistent and that you can trust and.
I do go through those in my book. And I would be glad tomention some of them here if you want. But, um, you know, on, on the kind ofcheaper end, some brands like, uh, now and Gero and doctors best and Nordicnaturals, and then like, uh, you know, like thorn life, extension, pureEncapsulations designs for health.
I think those are like some higher end ones that areconsistent. And those are the brands I would support that they've been aroundfor 20 years and they consistently test out and they have ingredients that arefull transparency. Like the, they list the, the ingredient, the form it's in,you know, the planning part it's coming from the dose of it.
Uh, and the standardization, it's all there and say, you cango look it up on examine.com or wherever you want to go. And you can say, doesthis dose does this form? That's what they, uh, what they claim makes sense.And you can go look it up for yourself.
Boomer Anderson: [00:45:49]And so for the average person listening to this, when they're looking toevaluate a supplement and just any particular supplement, obviously the brandsis very helpful.
And thank you for those suggestions, but just kind of goingthrough the lists of maybe sort of the red flags cause the red flags make melaugh a little bit. You already mentioned one proprietary blend. Uh, what aresome of the other red flags that cause you to, you know, you as a formulator tocringe a little bit?
Shawn Wells: [00:46:18]Yeah. I mean to, to go into proprietary blends, just so people know, uh, youcould have like this proprietary blend with like 20 ingredients, let's say,right. And, um, it's 700 milligrams for the, the power and strength blend andit could be 699 milligrams for that first ingredient in that parentheses and ofyour blend.
And it could be one milligram for the other 19 ingredients,and it's just silly. And yet you can list that and people, Oh, it's got all theingredients of all the things I've heard of that are good for building muscleor, you know, for blood sugar or whatever the products for, but you may not begetting any of it.
You're getting that first ingredient pretty much. And that'sthe only thing I could guarantee you. And quite often, that first ingredient isthe cheapest ingredient it's creatine or something, which, you know, they canbe a great ingredient, but it's a cheap one and all the expensive ones arelisted later and that's done very intentionally.
And you don't, when you list things in a prop blend, youdon't have to get them tested in the same way when you have the dose and theform and everything like the standardization listed out, and it's got to be atthis level, you don't have as much wiggle room there. So you have to test outat those levels.
You have to send it out to a lab and show that you. Your productis testing for a minimum of this. So I do not like proprietary blends. Uh, I, Ithink they're frustrating and I would love if we just didn't support productsthat have those and continue to move towards this full transparency. Uh,another thing to look at is that, for example, let's say with gin saying, youknow, you want to look at that it's the right part of the plant.
Sometimes they don't list what part, sometimes they mightsay with ginseng, you want the root that's relevant benefit is so they mightlist something that's very cheap instead because it just has ginseng. Theymight list flower or plants or whole plant or whatever. And that's a red flagto me obviously, is that, you know, that they would do that.
Uh, another red flag would be that there isn't somestandardization level for an herb. You want it to standardize to something likethat? We can go back to studies and look and say, this is the active component.It's gen set aside a that's for gen sing or total gen sennosides or whatever itis that's important.
Uh, another one to look at is the structure function claimsshould be aligned with, uh, the research and not be like ludicrous. Uh, if yousee, you know, 880% more, anything just run from that product, like that's,those are ridiculous marketing claims that are just, you can take somethingthat did next to nothing and then compare it to something that did almost nextto nothing.
And that's an 880% difference. No, it's not, it's not veryapplicable data. Like you can always manipulate data. So, uh, I like lookingat, you know, the study was a quality study. You know, that you can look up thedose in the form and again, go to someplace like examine.com and kind of do adeep dive on it.
And that would be great. Um, so just avoid stuff that thetoo good to be true claims. Um, and another thing to look at is make sure theexpiration date is solid. Um, you know, some people just pick up products. Uh,I like to look at when the expiration date is, um, and those companies shouldalso do what's called stability testing, where they see that the product testsout meets label claims at the, the end of expiration.
So it's a two year expiration. The product should meet labelclaims when it's made, but also meet label claims at two years later, that'swhere you have to actually do a lot of testing when you're formulating theseproducts to make sure if there's nutrient interactions or things that happen inblending that you put in overages.
But that'll meet that full shelf life. And then you also dothe stability work. Uh, that's accelerated with heat and moisture and you, youknow, you continue to test it out and say, okay, we need to tweak the formulaso that it continues to meet label claims and that's an ongoing process. Sothose are all things like, and you should be able to reach out to any of thesecompanies and say, can I see your lot testing?
Can I hear about what your quality control is? All thatstuff should be accessible. And if it isn't, then that's obviously a big redflag too. I mean, if you're willing to like double down and invest in acompany, and I think these are good questions that you can call the company andask if you're going to give them, you know, if you're like foreign is mycompany, I'm going all in on these guys.
I'm going to, you know, buy four products a month from them.That's thousands of dollars a year, potentially like you shouldn't give them acall and then feel comfortable with what they're doing.
Boomer Anderson: [00:51:27]Yeah. Uh, some great tips now, uh, the stability testing is an interesting oneand, you know, uh, I'm certainly one that reaches out to these companies to thepoint where they sometimes get annoyed with me.
But, uh, the stability testing, how frequently of thesecompanies, is it just sort of the best of breed that do stability testing, ordo you find that more and more people are kind of getting on that trend?
Shawn Wells: [00:51:53]I think it's more and more it's it's growing. Uh, there's a lot moreaccountability that's happening now because consumers are asking for it becausethere's education by people like me and you putting that information out there.
People are starting to demand it. And then also thesesupplement companies are getting bought by, uh, large food companies by pharmacompanies and they're risk averse. And, you know, there's. They may not be asexciting a brands when they get bought out. They may not be as edgy, but theydo put good practices in place to make sure stuff that's out to make sure thatthe, you know, legal claims are there, uh, to make sure everything's squaredaway from that perspective, that there's a lot less risk in my ability.
So in that sense, I'm seeing that have a really good impacton what best practice is on the industry. As a whole,
Boomer Anderson: [00:52:52]before we get into just one of my favorite topics, and I know one of theaudience's favorite topics of cognitive enhancement, you have this section ofthe book, which I believe is called formulators corner.
And it goes through in each chapter, you kind of take peoplethrough, uh, some of your thoughts around supplementation and things. Uh, andone, uh, that always comes up when Sean Wells has mentioned is Apple cidervinegar. Uh, How do we, how should people look at using Apple cider vinegar intheir kind of day-to-day life?
Shawn Wells: [00:53:27]Yeah, it's one of those things where it sounds like it's, um, you know, an oldwives tale and it's kind of Hocus Pocus and that can't be as good as it is.Here's what I would say. One Apple cider vinegar, like all vinegars contains ascenic acid. A scenic acid is the shortest chain fatty acid there is, and itfeeds the gut and acetate, uh, can help not only build ketones with a CDOT,acetate and acetone, but also, uh, when, when two are put together, you havelike, uh, the, the other short chainfatty acid butyrate that is massive gut fuel.
Um, there's also appropriate and eight, which is in between,um, which there's some new kind of data coming out on that that's interestingwith athletes and what they have in their gut, but butyrate and also beat rategoes to form beta hydroxybutyrate, and again, another ketones. So it's reallyinteresting.
Like I love these short chain, fatty acids, theirinteraction with not only gut health and then of course, brain health, gutbrain access. Um, you know, butyrate is a post biotic. That's how we'restarting to talk about it. That like that comes from these probiotic bacterialstrains. Um, so butyrate is, is powerful, but, uh, acetate acetic acid from thevinegar can fuel that gut fuel the brain and, you know, help with depression,mood, energy, all those things.
And then from there. And, and lower blood sugar improve, uh,um, blood pressure. That's what we're seeing with vinegar consistently. Onething I like about Apple cider vinegar in particular is that it has the motherin it and that's that, that swirly stuff at the bottom, that cloudy stuff,that's all the CDOT bacteria.
And again, that's feeding the gut. So I love this doubleshot for the gut. And people do see experientially a difference of like allthese things, and it seems almost too good to be true, but, you know, it's,it's because of all the things I said it's impacting, uh, it's a lot more thanjust a sour drink. So that's what I'd say.
Boomer Anderson: [00:55:51]do you serve it? Like, how are, how do you work it into your day? Because, youknow, for me, I'll take a shot of it before I eat something, but some people,and I'm just kind of curious, do you have like a Sean, most cocktail at homethat has Apple cider vinegar?
Shawn Wells: [00:56:07]I love it during fasting. Um, but I also, you know, sometimes it gives you likethat little zing that can kind of help you keep going.
You know, if you're kind of, if you want something likethat, you want to stay fasting, we could talk about how technical you are. Likewhat's a fast, what's not a fast, but I feel like, um, you know, having a shotof that is fun sometimes. Um, But I typically, I like using it, how you'resaying, uh it's if you're having a fatty meal, it's a great emulsifier of fat.
Uh, it can help with digestion of that. Um, but I can add itto water sometimes. Like if it's too potent for you, you know, if you don'tlike that taste, then just adding it to water, like taking one of those shots andjust adding it to a full glass of water, it kind of makes it less acidic. Andmaybe that's easier for you, you being whoever's listening.
So that, that would be what I'd suggest. But I like using itthe same way as you.
Boomer Anderson: [00:57:07]Okay. There, there, this is probably the number one questions looking forwardto asking you, by the way, Sean, there are zillions of compounds out there inthe world, and you're looking to add potential formulation and you've done over500 of these now, uh, as I found out earlier, but you.
Are trying to narrow down a list of compounds that wouldwork in particular situations. Can you take us through the process here?Because I imagine there's just endless infant testimonial amounts of researchthat you could be doing on these compounds. And so how do you, how do younarrow the field if you will?
Shawn Wells: [00:57:49]Yeah. And that reminds me of one thing I didn't mention with formulations isthat the next level of formulation beyond what I was talking about, things thatdon't test out, are they making sure they do things right? A real formulationby a formulator means that each ingredient has a purpose and fulfill somespecific mechanism of action.
And it's the best one for that. And that each ingredient hasa synergy where they would work together and make sense, put together not just,Oh, here's 10 ingredients that are all affect blood sugar. Okay. What is eachone doing? Like, are they all working on the same mechanism of action? Why didyou include 10 of them?
And there needs to be a thought process there. So that'spart of 65
Boomer Anderson: [00:58:38]in some cases.
Shawn Wells: [00:58:40]So that's part of the thought process there. Yeah. Quite often all look atingredients that, you know, I want to see that there's data there, or I'm goingto, I'm going to go find the data. Like this ingredient is very similar in, andit looks like, you know, in terms of biochemistry, in terms of organicchemistry, this ingredient is very similar and how this ingredient works.
But maybe because it's because it has this methyl group orwhatever, it's going to work a little bit better at that stage theoretical, butI'm going to work with my partner in China, uh, where we, he has, uh, over ahundred scientists, the 400,000 square foot facility. That's GMP. And I'm ableto create these ingredients and like weeks and like, I can like try them outwithin weeks and, you know, quite often I'll try them out on myself and, youknow, I'm the lab rat and, uh, but we can do, uh, animal research.
He has a love for that. And then I have two partners, uh, inthe United States that are German scientists, very accomplished Ralph, uh, Dr.Ralph Jaeger, Dr. Martin purpura, they've done hundreds of studies, uh, workedwith all kinds of labs work with all kinds of branded ingredient companies, uh,on things like HMB alpha GPC, PK, TP, all these kinds of ingredients.
And, um, that's part of it is like, I'll come up with thisidea. I'll run it by the team. I want to see is it, is it feasible on themanufacturing side with my Chinese partner? Is that, you know, does it havestability? Can it be made for a realistic price? Will we do enzymatic orfermentation or fulsome like synthetic, like how, I mean, we making it and theraw materials that go into making it, and then with my other partners, likelooking at, you know, what is the research around it?
What is the intellectual property around it? Like, whatcould we say if we come out with this, like how could we research this andcreate more intellectual property? That's largely what I'm doing now is I'veactually moved away from typically formulating. I do still some, for some very,uh, you know, significant partners, but mostly I've been focusing onintellectual property and novel ingredients.
So that's what I'm looking at is like, I want it to havelogic and rationale in terms that organic chemistry, biochemistry, it's workingon a pathway that, that pharmaceuticals looking to exploit, um, You know,something like that, like I'm looking at Brown adipose tissue and I don't know,like, you know, uh, PGC one alpha and, you know, whatever I'm looking at andlike, does this, does this ingredient potentially do that?
And then that's what we're exploring together as a team. Soit's that kind of stuff. It's really fun. I really, really enjoy it.
Boomer Anderson: [01:01:37]So at this point in your career, how many patents do you have on variousdifferent ingredients?
Shawn Wells: [01:01:46]Over 10, right. Um, but there's several more. There's about 10 more that havebeen filed recently.
Um, so it's probably about 20 and there's probably about 20more that, uh, are kind of in, in motion early this year. So a lot
Boomer Anderson: [01:02:01]very cool. It sounds like the team is very busy
Shawn Wells: [01:02:05]very much, but it's exciting. Like, you know, recently, you know, some of theingredients we've been working on, um, that I can talk about like Elba.
Uh, beta amino, ISO butyric acid. It's an exercise for medicand, um, you know, similar to the drugs, like a car or a GW, five Oh one five,one six, I believe. Is that
Boomer Anderson: [01:02:28]the, is that Austrian or what's the other name for it? I
Shawn Wells: [01:02:32]can't know. Uh, Carteret, I think there you go. Okay. I think Austrian is likeus for like a, sorry.
Um, yeah, yeah. Uh, but yeah, so this mimics exercise, whichwe can't go out and say it in the supplement world, because the FDA States thatyou need to say with healthy diet and exercise, but what I can say, and we'regetting the data around this now, and we're showing that it's elevated inplasma. When you take it orally, all this stuff, we're getting grass, which isgenerally recognized as safe, which means all the toxicology work.
There's a lot that goes into all this, but we can say thatit's an exercise. Augmenter. Like where you're getting more out of each rep ineach step. Like I'm trying to not promote the idea of, like, you can do sit onyour couch and, and reap the benefits, which is
Boomer Anderson: [01:03:19]although there's a certain amount of people that would love that.
Right, right, right,
Shawn Wells: [01:03:23]right. Exactly. I, I liked the idea that, of it being an augmenter and anotheringredients. Uh, L ergo thianine has been really fun as well. We have this ergotiny transporter in our body just for this ingredient. And we have storage ofthis ingredient in our body. And this is just crazy for me to find they wereactually considering whether it should be like a vitamin or not similar to PQ.
And it protects the mitochondria and it has a lot to dowith, um, the immune health and all these things. And it's just, it'sfascinating this ingredient. So we've been working on that. Um, And it's justsuper small doses, like five to 10 milligrams we're talking about of this aminoacid. So it's very interesting because it does have this transporter, you onlyneed very tiny doses.
It's just, it's absolutely fascinating. And so I love thisstuff. Wow.
Boomer Anderson: [01:04:19]Wow. Let's talk a little bit about cognitive enhancement because, uh, it's atopic that everybody listening to the show seems to love. And I know you'veeven got section of the book, uh, discussing nootropics in general, but givenjust sort of your vast knowledge and experience in this space, what do you kindof look at and say, this is sort of the current frontier or best of breed.
Cognitive enhancers. And I know that there's kind ofdifferent categories and you lay this out very beautifully in the book, but howdo you look at cognitive enhancement ingredients right now? And what are someof your favorites?
Shawn Wells: [01:05:03]Yeah, there's a, there's a lot of places that you can cover. I mean, there'speptides like, uh, directs or cerebral license there's plant medicines, likesiliciden and that are going to enhance BDNF, the neuroplasticity in the brain.
Right. Um, and then like
Boomer Anderson: [01:05:22]ketamine, right. Ketamine
Shawn Wells: [01:05:25]and there's, you know, drugs, uh, that are certainly like, um, I take, uh,Provigil or Nuvigil from time to time. I mean, obviously that's a greatnootropic. And then there's these gray market compounds, these different raceTams and, um, you know, things like cooler, race Tam and, and, you know, pairof CEDAM and all these different things.
Uh noopept which I do mentioned in the book, but I tried inthe book to really focus because this is meant for more mainstream. My, my nextbook, I think I'm going to go into peptides, plant medicines and biologics.She'll be like more hardcore, like I think a longevity focused book that's,that's kind of taking this step forward past where I think this book is, uh,but I wanted this book to be accessible.
So I I'm mostly described stuff that you can buy easily andis healthy and has very clear demonstrated scientific, uh, validity. So I thinkany nootropic stack has to be built around, um, a Coleen, like a really goodColeen source, uh, which would be something like CDP calling or my favorite oneis alpha GPC that has the ability to pass by the blood-brain barrier.
Uh, you know, Coleen forms, acetylcholine, uh, which isneuro-transmitter, um, you know, which you burn through quite a bit of likewhen you're focused in these, you know, kind of nootropic these cognitiveenhancement States, and then also your, your brain is made up of these, thesefats that, that need like pasta title Coleen, plus the title Sierra and allthese fossil lipids.
So it has dual benefit and I'm just a huge fan of Coleen.And unless you're eating eggs every day or taking a supplement with Coleen andevery day, you're not getting enough Coleen, they've shown that. So I thinkit's really good to build that as your foundation. And then from there, I wouldlook at some of the key methylators associated with neuro conduction, um, likethings like, uh, five methyltetrahydrofolic, the active form of full aid,methyl, cobalamin, the active form of B12.
Uh, I do like noopept. Uh, as a race, Tam is very, it's,it's more accessible than, than most of the others and a lot less complicatedand a really low dose. It's 10 to 30 milligrams a day. Start with 10 work yourway up. See what you think. I don't like stacking a bunch of race Tams, Ithink, with anything nootropic there's, there's the discussion in my book, likein that first chapter you're talking about, about like bio-individuality andkind of figuring out your own stack.
This is like 10 X is true in neutral. Perfect. If you lookat any one stack, if you go to Reddit or wherever, every single person stack isdifferent, you cannot just jump in and take someone's stack that they built outover two or three years.
Boomer Anderson: [01:08:18]So it must drive you nuts because it drives me nuts. When you kind of see theseFacebook forums where people are like, what do you think of my stack?
And then they list 10 different things or whatever, becausein reality, if it works for them, it works for them. It may not work for me.Right.
Shawn Wells: [01:08:35]Especially with neuro-transmitters like, it's just, people are so different.Um, so you know, some things that are, you know, enlightening and energizingfor some might give you brain fog and headaches.
It just doesn't end. And maybe it will work for you if slowdosed ramp up over time with just one thing. But you have to give it time. Likeyou can't just go right into like this full on stack. Like it's really good todo the one thing at a time, the scientific method evaluate what it's doing foryou. Is it working for me?
Is it not? Okay, let me go on to the next thing. You know,instead of just throwing the kitchen sink at it, which obviously doesn't worktoo well. Um, another thing that I would mentioned that is very cognitiveenhancing would be raising ketone levels. And there's a variety of ways to dothat. You can do that obviously with intermittent and especially extendedfasting.
You can do that with a ketogenic diet, especially the lowercarb you go, the higher tons will be so doing like zero carb, carnivores isgoing to like elicit highest ketones. Then you can use exogenous ketones likethe salts or asters you can use CA MCTs caprylic acid, MCTs. Uh, those aregoing to elicit the most ketones and you can use things like berberine ordihydro berberine as a glucose disposal agent to kind of hasten that.
And then you can also do glycogen depletion exercise whereyou're like things like hit high intensity interval training. Well, depleteglycogen very quickly and help you get into that state where you're starting.These ketones and ketones are elevated, but those are great for the brain. Thebrain loves ketones, uh, and it can be quite healing when you shift the wayfrom, uh, especially like if you've had a trauma to the brain, like, um, atraumatic brain injury, uh, that area can be very similar in research.
It's found to like, uh, an Alzheimer's type brain where it'sinsulin resistant in those cells, those brain cells. So providing thatalternate fuel source can, you know, surpass that, that mitochondrialdysfunction, uh, and provide that, that fuel source, that energy to make ATPthe cellular energy source. So you're no longer in that insufficient cellularenergy state in your brain.
So that can be healing to your brain. To have the ketonesand switch off from the glucose. And of course, like if you haveneurodegenerative diseases or have a tendency towards those, it's definitelysomething to look at as well as you don't need to stay on keto year round. I'mjust saying like, do some things to raise ketones from time to time.
Like whether it's a ketogenic diet here and there, you know,a couple of times a year for several months or whether it's, uh, you know,doing extended or intermittent fasting in your schedule, doing glycogendepletion, taking a glucose disposal agent like Metformin or berberine ordihydro, berberine, things like that are going to be good for your long-termbrain health.
Especially when we're exposed to high-glycemic carbohydrate.We're not moving enough. We're not fasting enough, all those kinds of things.So, uh, those can all be helpful. Uh, at raising ketones. The last thing I'dsay is what we were talking about before is increasing BDNF and increasing, um,cerebrovascular, uh, vascularity, uh, vasodilation would be the poly phenolgroup I feel is just powerful.
It's just across the board in all aspects of anti-agingoxidation, glycation, inflammation, methylation, like, uh, activating thesirtuin genes. I mean, they're CR mimetics, chloric restriction, mimetics, likethe polyphenols. It's just an amazing group. And if you look at like all these,uh, um, Lucem cultures, they all have like these polyphenol, you know, it's theolive oil and the red wine, and, you know, it's the cacao and it's the greentea.
And. You know, it's very interesting to look at like allthese foods and beverages are high in polyphenols and they have a much greaterpropensity to pan out versus typical antioxidant supplementation. Um, which isvery, the data's very conflicting on, and I love polyphenols for this. And somost of the polyphenols also have been shown to increase that neuroplasticity,the BDNF, um, which as we age, um, we have, uh, a crystallized intelligence anda fluid intelligence and the crystallized intelligence is how we can actuallyget smarter.
As we age, we get better and better at the shortcuts, right?Like, you know, take that same way to work. And like the 50th time, like you'relike dialed, like, you know, every nuance and that's how we get smarter as weage. But we get quote unquote dumber as we age with the fluid intelligence,where the ability to take on new tasks.
And that's where it's important to take your polyphenols, todo, to raise ketones, to challenge your brain with brain games or with takingdifferent ways to work or learning a new instrument or a new language, or, youknow, using your belt the opposite way or holding your brush with the oppositehand or, you know, doing this stuff like to keep it confusing and fresh, uh,helps your brain stay more neuroplastic.
But so do these, uh, polyphenols that that would be veryhelpful as you age and some, Oh, sorry. Some examples, those polyphenols thingslike queer sit in which you would find in, uh, like apples and onions uh ETCGwhich you find in green tea, um, uh, let's see, resveratrol trans resveratrol,which you find in red wine.
Um, Uh, coffee, Berry, which you find the coffee, uh, whichhas chlorogenic acid is typically one of the polyphenols in there. Um,terrorist from blueberries. So like, these are, you know, as you start thinkingabout this and you're like, Oh, like, these are the things it's like, these cultureslike thrive on and live on and like are stable.
Um, you know, these are like powerful things that help withour staying young. So I would, uh, if I was to like recommend like one group ofthings to really focus on it's these polyphenols.
Boomer Anderson: [01:15:19]Amazing Sean. Let's, let's get into the book because we've kind of dabbled inhinted at it for people today, but the energy formula, do you mind justbreaking down for us what energy actually stands for in this case?
Because it's an acronym and I would love to just have peopleunderstand a little bit about
Shawn Wells: [01:15:38]that. Yeah. So, uh, it's yeah, the energy formula and I was trying to figureout like what all of this work for me and my life revolved around. And, youknow, I can talk about biohacking. I can talk about keto and, and supplementsand exercise and all these different things, the labs I was getting, but it allrevolved around me wanting to have more energy, more vitality, more, just notfeeling, you know, I know chronic fatigue syndrome.
I know obesity, I know inflammation and pain. I know notbeing able to get out of bed. I know suicidal thoughts and depression. I know,not feeling like I'm enough. I know hating myself. And so like the energyformula just felt right for me. And then I kind of constructed this acronym,uh, that is experiment, you know, for the first E and that's that whole, uh,biohacking and bio-individuality and figuring out what really worked for youand using that scientific method and not trying to just apply things that workfor other people that can be directional.
It can be informative, but that may not work for you. Andthe book goes through like how to, how to properly employ that. Um, the nextone would be nutrition and I get into Leo in carnival or vegan, like go throughall those things and what might work for you? Uh, certainly I can tell you.Without a doubt that, uh, ultra processed food is something that you shouldmove away from.
And I think everyone should agree on that. And I think peoplethat argue over, you know, vegan being the healthiest diet, and then somepeople are saying carnival, and it seems so opposite. Right. Andcounterintuitive. But I think when I hear that, I'm just like, yes, those arewhole food. Cool. We agree on that.
Animals have been living for millions of years on either, soyep. Carnivore vegan. Cool. It's the boat that's going along in the last 50years, that's garbage and making a sick and is the reason that America, despitehaving amazing healthcare and disposable income and supposedly the best ofeverything we're ranked so low in the world when it comes to our health and ourmortality, I would say a big reason is, I mean, Food availability.
And then the ultra processed food, like we have too muchfood available too easily, so we don't fast. So we don't have to work for it.We don't have to put much thought into it. We can just say, this is what I wantright now. And I think that's good and get it. Um, but ultra processed food,for sure. And not only is it ultra processed, which seems unhealthy with theGMOs and the antibiotics and the artificial flavors, sweeteners, colors, andall the things that are in it, all these chemicals, but it's meant to bemanipulative.
It's, there's something in it called bliss point. And theyengineered these foods so that you overeat them. They override satiety and theytrigger dopamine and serotonin in your brain. And it's like explosion, orgasm.And that's why we're overeating these foods. I get into all that kind of stuff.And then, uh, the next one is exercise.
I get into exercise hacks things like you, you probably doknow of high intensity interval training, but you might not know interest'sthat stretching and blood flow restriction. And some of these other fun hacksthat are really good to know that can get more.
Um, and I get into routines like some morning and nighttimeroutines and, you know, that's a massive part of success is just, you know, youset the pace for your day with a morning routine. Tim Ferriss found in tools ofTitans that successful people all had two things in common. They wereexperimenters, which I talked about in that first chapter.
They don't view things as winter fail. They view things aswin or learn, and I will continue to experiment. Oh, a winter learned meansit's a reframe and that's what some other, uh, people have noted that sickpeople, all of that reframing and totality in mind. And I'll get to that in mynext chapter that I'll talk about in a second.
But the other thing that these successful people had thatTim Ferriss found was morning routines. They're really good at starting theirday successfully dialed planning, you know, starting it with a, uh, a presenceon mindfulness, not feeling like rushed and out of control. And like the day ishappening to you.
You know, that you are in control, that you planned out yourday looking for things to come up, but it won't steer your entire day and steeryou into oblivion. So it's a very different mindset and we get into all thatand get into the nighttime routines that help you. Set like very good sleephygiene it's called and where you have like consistent bedtime and you have asleep fortress and all those kinds of things.
How you prepare your mind for the night. The next one, likeI was saying that reframing mentality, it's so important with success andhappiness, that's in the growth chapter and we also get into, um, intermittentor extended. Um, but that's the big one is to, so as you know, the obstacle isthe way like Ryan, so like running for no obstacle, we're not wishing for ashortcut around the obstacle.
We realized that the obstacle is the way, and that is theidea of, for me SIS too. And, you know, biologically that we challengeourselves and then, you know, the agitation leads to adaptation, right? But ithas to be the whole thing that I get into in the book is like that, thatGoldilocks zone and positive stress, which is called use stress, not distresswhere it's training too much.
And that's where you can look at like HRV and have yourwearables and all that, and make sure that you're recovered enough. There'sactually, um, there's a term that I like that's come up more recently with, uh,research has talked about over-training for years with athletes, but I like theterm, there's a newer term.
That's under recovered. It's a different way to look at thesame idea. Um, and then the last one is your tribe, and that's really talkingabout community. And again, going back to those blue zones where I've been tolike Sardinia several times, for example, and they spend three, four hourshaving dinner, they prepare the meal, they connect, they open up, they commune.
And it's a very different feeling than just rushing througha meal and shoving food in your face. And I actually have some theories thatpsychosomatically that we're triggering our body for, uh, you know, sympatheticnervous system activation when we're eating, because we're eating while we'rewatching game of Thrones with like sex and violence for eating, while we're inthe car, shoving food in our face, weaving in and out of traffic.
We're eating while we're at work out of a vending machine,we're under heavy stress and we need that monster in the, and the honeybun, youknow, what is, what is the act of eating you're training your body for it,you're training it for stress. And it's very different from the way they eatand psychosomatically, like they're approaching it to like parasympathetic,like they're ready to relax for three or four hours at the table.
And. Yeah, that's today, but they're having it well, or thething while they're talking and are sipping, and it's a very differentexperience than just pounding some wine. So it's hard to tease that out as likethe, the culture is very different. They slowed down. They're not looking at theirphones when they're talking to each other.
That's some of what I get into and the energy formula, ithas like 70 full color diagrams, over a hundred scientific citations, um,surveys that help you out through the book, like where you're at and where you'regoing. So you can judge your success, all that kind of stuff is in there. SoI'm really proud of this book.
It has a lot of my stories like you talked about. Um, soit's very personal. Um, but talking about like, they go into the supplements offorms that doses to the brands and then resource hacks in each chapter getsinto. Um, all the stuff with, uh, devices and apps and all those kinds ofrecommendations. So it's just loaded with stuff you can use.
You can go to energy, formula.com and see everything aboutit. And I would love it if you support it. Uh, it's only 99 cents as an ebook,which is very cheap. And I just want people to have it in their hands and I'llcome out with a hardcover that's 39 99, but that's literally, it cost me 39 80to make it.
And then I'm doing a recording next week in LA on the book.So that'll be out soon too, but it's literally a labor of love. I just wantpeople to have it and benefit from it. This is my gift to the world. Likethat's all it's about. Like, I didn't take any money from any of the brandsthat are mentioned in there.
I wanted it to be completely honest information, and I'mjust proud of that. I'm proud of what I'm putting out.
Boomer Anderson: [01:25:15]And I was telling you before we clicked record Sean, that, you know, the firstchapter alone is worth purchasing for people in the sense that you walkthrough. How, if you think about just what the basic person spends onsupplements right.
Every year, and that could be in the hundreds of thousandsof dollars, right? And in certain cases, how to select those supplements, whatbrands to get into, and then just kind of taking us through what some of thebest of breeds are in these various categories. That to me is just well worth.I mean, it's only 99 cents.
Like why not buy it? But, uh, like you did put a lot of workinto this. I can tell it. And it's fantastic. So thank you for putting togetherthe book.
Shawn Wells: [01:26:04]Oh, thank you so much. That means a lot coming from you. Like I. Yeah. That'slike one of the most nerve wracking things is like, when you're, when yourpeers like judge, you know, and it's like, well, will it be okay?
And, uh, yeah, I'm, I'm proud of it. It's, there's so muchattention to detail here that it took two years to really hone this thing in.So I'm very proud of it and it means a lot that you like it.
Boomer Anderson: [01:26:30]Sean Wells, where can people find out more about you, your work? You alreadymentioned where to get the book, but where can people learn more about you?
Shawn Wells: [01:26:40]Uh, Shawn wells.com, S H a w N w E L L S. And then I'm at Sean Wells, samespelling on Instagram. Um, and I'm starting to get into clubhouse. That's beenan interesting one of late, um, just at bio hacking on there. Um, so that's beenfun, a lot of great conversations with great people that are on our level.
And it's really fun just having these. Uh, almost like, um,you know, these panels that, you know, I love like when we're at conferences,when those used to happen, like it's nice to have like these expert panels andjust, and just talk with each other as, as experts. And it's fun to workthrough these things.
So I've enjoyed that. Um, but those would be the best placesto find me. And, uh, and I appreciate anyone supporting the book and tellingtheir friends about it. It's obviously I think a great value, a great deal atthe price. You can get it at, I don't think 99 cents should be a barrier atthis point. It'll go up after launch, but definitely appreciate peoplesupporting it.
And if they go to energy, formula.com, I also have a, ahidden chapter. That's also free. Um, that's on movement, natural movement,which I think is very important. I mean, animals don't work out. I, I'm not,I'm definitely for working out, but I get into like how natural movement shouldbe built into our day.
And then, uh, I have the fasting guide, uh, fasting forenergy that is free as well. Uh, that goes into depth on, on fasting. So thosethings are free. If you go to energy, formula.com, if you go straight toAmazon, you won't get those free things, but I appreciate the support no matterwhat. And I obviously appreciate your support because you're amazing.
And it's so awesome to be on this show and talk to you. Andit's been a complete pleasure boomer. Uh, I love all the people that haverecommended me, uh, to you. And, uh, that's it's like, wow, then this guy'sreally, really awesome. So, and you have been, and, um, I'm excited to, uh,develop the friendship more.
Boomer Anderson: [01:28:45]Likewise, and I think this is just the first of many conversations and Sean,thank you so much for coming on today. It's been an absolute pleasure. Uh, justlearning from you and hearing all these stories and. Whenever you want, the micis always yours. You're welcome back. Thank you for coming.
Shawn Wells: [01:29:06]Thank you brother.
Boomer Anderson: [01:29:09]I said before, Sean is a wealth of information on the supplement industry andso many other things. In fact, I really enjoyed that. He was so open about hispersonal experience with everything from body dysmorphia, uh, to some of themore psychological issues he's battled through. Sean, thank you for coming onthe show and you guys should all check out his book because he has a reallywicked offer on it right now.
And I mean, wicked in the best of ways you should go andcheck out his book, which we'll link to in the email@example.com slash Shawn S H a w N. Thank you, everyone forlistening. Have an absolutely .
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