Health Optimization

Dave Siever: Optimize The Brain with Audio - Visual Entrainment

Boomer Anderson
April 5, 2022
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Dave Siever joins the show to talk about audio visual entrainment. We delve deep into audio visual entrainment, its history, the scientific studies behind it, the typical use cases, clinical applications, and of course Dave's history.

Who is Dave Siever? 

Dave Siever, C.E.T., graduated from the Northern Alberta Institute of Technology (NAIT) in 1978 in Telecommunications. In 1980, he accepted a position at the University of Alberta, Faculty of Dentistry, as a design technologist. He conducted research with Dr. Norman Thomas, an internationally recognized specialist in the area of temporomandibular dysfunction and myofascial pain.

From late 1985 to 1987, Dave provided TMJ consulting services to 5 dentists in the Edmonton area. Over the years, Dave has helped treat approximately 1,500 patients with TMJ and MPD. During this time, Dave realized that many TMJ problems were psychologically-related, prompting him to pursue his interest in biofeedback. This led to the inception of the original D.A.V.I.D. 1 in the spring of 1985, which was used in the Faculty of Arts to help acting students overcome stage fright.

In the time since, Dave has continued developing several audio-visual entrainment (AVE), cranio-electro stimulation (CES), transcranial DC Stimulation (tDCS), and biofeedback devices, with each new development responding to technology changes and market demands. Dave still designs new products related to personal growth and well-being.

Dave served for many years as the chair of the Computer Engineering Advisory Council for the NAIT. He's also a member of ASET, ISNR, and AAPB.


[3:25] Dave’s transition from electronics to studying the bran

[11:30] The roots of Audio Visual Entrainment

[19:45] Experiences from Audio Visual Entrainment

[27:25] Randomized Audio Visual Entrainment (RAVE)

[32:05] AVE devices for particular situations

[39:01] Settings for anxiety or stress therapy 

[45:10] Effects of gamma waves

[50:20] Clinical use cases for AVE


1957 Brainwave Synthesizer

"Recovery Now - Brain Injury Talk Radio"

Roscoe's Wetsuit Neuro podcast 



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Episode Transcript

[00:00:00] Boomer: Welcome to decoding superhuman. Thisshow is a deep dive into obsessions with health performance, and how to elevatethe human experience. I explore the latest tools, science and technology withexperts in various fields of human optimization. This is your host. Enjoy thejourney

today on the podcast. We're going to talk about audio visualentrainment. If you are unfamiliar with that term, or just curious, stay tuned,audio visual entrainment is something that I've used for the past six months,several times a week. I've worked on anything from sleep to focus to reallyjust enjoying a gamma meditation.

And my guest today is Dave Siever. He's the founder ofsomething called mind alive. And the device I use is the mind alive delight,bro. We delve deep into audio, visual entertainment, the history of it, thescientific studies behind it use cases, clinical applications. And of courseDave's history. If you want to check out the show notes for this one, it's atdecoding alive when you've traveled around the worldextensively.

And at this point I've been to 60 plus countries. Don't plan onstopping. Anytime soon, you come to realize how important high quality wateris, and if you've ever had diarrhea as a result of low quality water, you know exactlywhat I mean. Right? And so when I went down the wormhole on how to have thebest water for my house, for my office in my house, I ended up talking to agentleman by the name of Robert Slovak.

We actually recorded a podcast together and I got really intohis device. The have one sitting here next to me right now. I use it to brew mycoffee in the morning. I also use it for just my regular drinking water. I mustsay it's pretty freaking awesome. If you want an awkward, true head on over todot com and use the code boomer because you'll get yourself a nice discount.

Let's get back to the show,

Dave, welcome to the show.

[00:02:40] Dave: Hi boomer. Thank you for inviting me

[00:02:42] Boomer: an absolute pleasure because you knowone, now I can have a conversation with you about these glasses that my wifesees me wearing every day around the house. Uh, and she can understand a littlebit more about what I'm doing to myself, but also it's a, it's a technologythat I've been fascinated with for the past several months.

And I know it's been around for a long time and I want to divea lot into Ave, audio, visual, and treatment with you today. But I think it'sappropriate to start with the man, the myth of himself. How do you, how did youcome into the study of the brain? Really? Because I know your background was abit in engineering.

If I'm not mistaken.

[00:03:30] Dave: Yes. My background is in electronics andif tronics is probably one of the best backgrounds you can have, if you want tostudy the brain, uh, cause it's all electrical and wave forms and timing andoscillators and all this stuff. So now this is probably the best field youcould have is having electronics background.

But how I got into this is I. Atlanta to job at the universityof Alberta, D designing a research lab for TMJ dysfunction, and that's peoplewith jaw problems, you know, tension and, uh, muscle spasms and all that kindof stuff. Usually there's, well, we didn't know what those days, but there'stypically an anxiety component generally attached to it.

Anyway. Yeah. So it's designing this research lab. And one ofthe things that I was did that I was hired to design was a thing called thesilent period detector, which has to do with the jaw. And what it is is thatwhenever you bite your teeth together, the, uh, this post synaptic neurons aresensors that fire in the, in the trigeminal nerve.

And they paralyze your jaw every time your teeth touch your jawparalyzes temporarily. And that is to keep us from breaking our teeth when webite. And so there's this, you'll see a whole pile of E M G, and then there'sa. And then it comes up again and I built this device to measure that in time.It, so, uh, at the time, of course we didn't know quite what we were doing, butwe're trying to determine just how severe a person's bike was.

Like, if you have a bunch of teeth and one's hitting and thenanother, then another, then another, and they're all adding like a 20millisecond inhibition period. Those will add up and you could have 60, 80milliseconds of dead zone, uh, in your bite or in your muscles, uh, before theact reactivate. And that was a sign that Chris had really bad fitting teeth.

But what we found out by accident was that we had so many ofour, of our patients that we could never get them better. We would make asplint for them. And then we would adjust it every three weeks. We would adjustit and adjust it, adjust it and adjust it. It seemed to help them for three orfour weeks.

And then they had to come back in and get it readjusted becauseit was never right. Well, that turned out to be a placebo effect. And studiesstudies have been done since then to show that it's a placebo effect. So we'rebasically giving a lot of our patients placebo. But what I did observe with alot of those people that we couldn't really treat is that there's, the silentperiod was really short or the time it was like 15, 20 milliseconds, whichmeant that a lot of them actually had a very good bite.

And the problem wasn't anatomical, it was psychological. And startedfiguring that out at, at no over the time when I was there. But I got to saythat once I got into the physiology side of electronics, I found that it is soutterly fascinating. I just absolutely love physiology. I had no idea that Icould have absolutely would have loved to have been a doctor, but I'mdefinitely glad I've got my electronics without it.

I might not have appreciated it so much, but oh man, did I likephysiology? So I started teaching it, uh, and of course I had to learnphysiology to design electronics to, to test all these things that are going onin the body, biofeedback devices and stimulators and so on. Uh, so I just, youknow, such a beautiful fit for me.

I absolutely loved it. And I ate, breathe, breathe, and slept,uh, physiology all the time and read just hundreds and hundreds of no books andarticles. Studies of all kinds of typically had the electrical physiology side,more tied in with them and, and how the body function. Uh, but in 1984, uh, uh,an instructor in performing arts had heard that there were a couple of madscientists up in dentistry and myself and Dr.

Thomas, who was the professor I worked with. Um, cause we usedto wire ourselves up with like 20 electrodes, have a big pig tail hail off forour neck failed

[00:07:31] Boomer: backyard, like a QE kind of thing.

[00:07:35] Dave: Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Yeah. At the timewe were doing porous muscle, but, um, but anyway, yeah, we had this big, bigtail and we go for lunch with this big pig tail of wires.

Usually they were hanging off my face cause I was the Guineapig and um, So this sort of reputation grew that there were mad scientists upthere in the dentistry building. And, uh, so anyway, instructor in 1984 andinstructor in performing arts had heard of this crazy new age technique. Atleast that's what I thought it was at the time, a flashing lights in the eyesand sounds in the ears.

And it was good for putting people into hypnotic transits. Uh,and he got, he, he got ahold of me and asked me to build him this device. And,and I thought, well, I could give it a shot, I guess. And, uh, it took, Istarted that in like, I think November. Of 84 and finished at roughly July of85. It turned out to be a massively huge project.

He didn't know what he actually even wanted. He didn'tunderstand how it worked. And then I had to do a whole bunch of learning onthis end because I had not heard of audio visual and treatment before. And Ididn't know if it worked either. I really thought it was kind of a new age scamof some sort and that it was probably going to fail anyway.

Well, they did have really, really cool dissociative aspects toit where it could kind of trance you out and

[00:08:54] Boomer: like almost second to like kind ofdissociative, like a

[00:08:58] Dave: yeah, in those days it was extremelypsychedelic cause I was using different types of stimulation than what I donow. And so I was generating huge evoked potentials in the brain and I'd seemassive kaleidoscopes of gorgeous colors and patterns as if you're lookingactually at a kaleidoscope, this is like a new, a neuronal neuronal,kaleidoscope.

It was wild. The stuff I used to see in the old. Uh, we don'tdo that now with our gear because there's, there's risks associated with that.And it doesn't actually train the brain properly when you do it that way. Uh,but it was sure, awesome to look at it and assure, help cut with anxiety. Andin those days I had pretty severe anxiety in Canada.

The interest rates are 18%. We had a house, we had universitydidn't pay much. Yeah. 18%. And so money was really, really tight. Now I spenta lot of, a lot of hours on the ground getting oil and grime and dirt in myface, fixing old cars because I couldn't afford a car more than a, that wasworth more than about a grand at best.

I think most of my cars are about $500, but, um, anyway, um, soanyway, I was using it, I'd make two devices and I was using the other one onmyself as well. And it was really helping me get through some tough days of.And then when we were recognizing the signature in our TMJ patients, wethought, well, you know, if a lot of them are struggling with anxiety andpsychological issues, maybe I should be trying our gear on them.

So we took our 10 worst patients who had severe pain for 10years and jaw tension and everything else. I put EMGs on them. We did fingertemperature as well because the warming of the hands is a sign of going into aparasympathetic state. Well, these people all had cold hands. You know, theyare tenths jaws, a lot of.

And I ran them on the old David one. And in about 10 minutes,temperature, just going way up in their hands. Uh, jaw tension just droppedfrom like several microvolts down to about half, which is like extremelyrelaxed. And their pain was gone for two days on average, completely gone. Thatwas the first pain relief that many of them had in two years or 10 years asidefrom taking a great deal of drugs.

So then I thought, well, okay, there's gotta be more to this,to this technology. And then just being a new age gimmick. And so then I gotpretty serious about going to the health sciences library and digging up asmuch research as I could find on you. Visually evoked, potentials, flickerstimulation, and treatment, whatever I could find for keywords and startedamassing volumes and volumes and volumes of research.

It turns out there are thousands of studies on blinking lightsin brainwave. But, but there are not very many studies on the subjective effectsgo. How do you feel when you're on a train? But there were still probably I'veprobably still found a good dozen anyway, that had been done in some, by somefairly leading people.

Well, it turns out that in treatment, there was a commercialdevice that was already available in 1958 called the brainwave synchronizer.And, uh, and it was actually quite serious research equipment. And other peoplehad been experimenting with the treatment as well.

[00:12:10] Boomer: But none of this stuff was really likecommercial at this

[00:12:13] Dave: point.

Was it? No, no. It was a commercial. No, not to, not to theretail market. The brainwaves synchronizer was almost sold in primarily forresearchers at universities and stuff. Yeah. It wasn't commercial. And it turnsout that how this thing spun was that there was a physician in the second worldwar named William Kroger.

And when the, when the Americans were in the second world warand they were taking their battleships, you know, with long droning engines andstuff like this, which helps put the person into trance or bomber planes withlong droning engines, that they would find that they would fly into enemyterritory and suddenly they're getting shot at, and the opera and the radar guyshould have seen it coming long ago on the radar, but they found often theradar guy was in trance and it turns out that the old fashioned radars couldn'thold an image on screen, like a modern.

Uh, TV does or monitor now does now. So the old radars, theywould just, the blip would go around as it went around, there'd be a blip and ablip and a blip, and that blip helped lull them into this trance. And theywould just watch the enemy come on screen and just gave them,

[00:13:23] Boomer: I mean, I could see how this wouldhappen and obviously it did happen, but that's fascinating to me that thismachinery would put people, very people that are operated in a trance to thestate where they couldn't operate it.

[00:13:34] Dave: Yes, exactly. Anyway, that promptedWilliam Kroger to team up with a guy named Sydney Schneider out of Ohio, andthey built in the world sort of first commercialized, um, uh, brainwavesynchronization device or audio sort of visual entrainment device, uh, whichthey called the brainwave synchronizer. And that came out in 1957.

I have one actually in my office that I bought off eBay. Wow.

[00:13:58] Boomer: The I'm I imagine that's a little bitof an antique, these.

[00:14:02] Dave: Yeah, it's still a works. Mine actuallyhas a neon light on it. So it's, it's orangy. Did they? They went to Xenon thenext year, but so I've got one of the very original models. Um, yeah, so that'show it kind of got started.

And now the David name, uh, the guy dissolve belt did for, atthe end of the day, I made a dollar an hour over about a thousand hours. Uh,and he just, because he didn't know what he was doing and he did. And anyway,and he didn't have the money and whatever else. So I was going to call it aneuro stem Hemi sync, or some kind of a neurotech kind of a name.

And he said, no, no, no, you've been working on it for adollar. Now I even name it. Something that is kind of honors you in someregards. And I'm like, well, okay, we'll find it. It's still making it for himso I could put whatever name on the panel he wanted, but I kind of wanted toput a brand name. Uh, anyway, he comes back.

Well, I want to call the thing the David and I go, geez, nothanks. And he goes, no, no. I thought it's through the digital audio visualintegration device. We're integrating brainwaves through digital audio visualstimulation. And I thought, well, that is kind of a clever acronym. Um, okay.We'll give it a shot.

Uh, meanwhile, uh, th these old machines had had, uh, they were10 by 10 systems and they were 10 inch by 10 inch centimeter wise. I'm not surewho your audience is, but 25 by 25 centimeters or so. Okay. And, uh, and theyhad a large panel that I had to wrap around them and glue. And they'realuminum, big aluminum frame on, on the front.

And, uh, and it was like $1,500 to make one panel or 1700 tomake a hundred because once they get going, it's all set up fees, right. Soonce they go on, they can just print them off cheap. So I had a hundred mate,which is good. I destroyed the first half dozen that I tried rapping on thisfirst unit, uh, before I figured out how to glue them down.

And, and then we, then we started making the devices and peoplewere asking for them and I thought, wow, there's actually a world out therethat knows about this stuff. Uh, yeah, out of the blue people were calling meup and ordering a device. And in those days there were about $3,500. Uh, so alittle more expensive than now.

And, but anyway, um, Yeah, after we started burning through thehundred or so I was going to change the name of getting to a, uh, some kind ofa brain name, but by then wall street journal, uh, and I think financial postsand some other magazines had done re uh, review articles on us and people werecalling up asking for their David.

So I thought, well, you know, I'll just leave the name sit. So,uh, that's where it came from, but people say, oh, aren't you self-importantsometimes I get that. And I go, no, no, I didn't. I didn't come up with this.

[00:16:43] Boomer: If you go on the website and you seethe, the acronym, you do have the periods in between, uh, for those that are,are particular about detail, but I could see where somebody would ask thatquick.

[00:16:54] Dave: Yep. . Yeah. So anyway, that's kinda mybackstory since then. Now we have, it's really taken off we've we've gotstudies on everything we, uh, have, uh, over two dozen studies on our gearalone. I think there's 28 studies at the moment on the debate David devices.And, um, uh, two are coming out right now. One is on event related potentialsby John LeMay, and he's found that one session of entrainment speeds up thebrain's processing time and get more synchronized.

So there's a larger ERP pulse that comes off it, but I'm alsolearning that in treatment. Isn't really entrainment. Uh, either

[00:17:32] Boomer: you're going to have to explain thatone a

[00:17:34] Dave: little bit. I will have to do that. It'sentrainment is the least of what entrainment does. So it's been now poorlylabeled, uh, and the reason why the entrainment name first came out or novisual evoked responses was another term that was with it.

Stimulus in, you know, flashing away on your eyes and a brainresponse out that synchronizes with the stimulus. Well, in the old days, whenyou use 50,000 Lux, you know, super bright square wave, intense strobe lights,you had a pretty good brain response that, that kicked in response to thestimulus, but, but it was an evoked response.

And, um, it wasn't, uh, it wasn't quite a real response, butsince then, can you

[00:18:18] Boomer: just quickly define evoked versus realthere? Um, so it evoked responses triggered, is that what

[00:18:25] Dave: it is, or, uh, an evoked responsebasically is a firing mechanism through parts of the brain that especially theoccipital cortex, where the vision is process that kicks back.

But, uh, but a real response, in a sense, it gets, it gets thethalamus involved because all of our brainwaves pretty much, well not betawaves, but certainly alpha theta Delta are, are an oscillator between thecortex and the thalamus. In fact, all of our senses except smell go through thethalamus into the brain.

And if you activate the thalamus, the whole brain willresonate. Not just the visual cortex or other parts of it, but the whole, theentire brain will resonate if you go through the thalamus. But it turns outthat sine wave stimulation does a much better job of activating the wholecortical thalamic loop.

Then a little square wave pulse does that you might see likeoff of a strobe light.

[00:19:19] Boomer: Interesting. Uh, Dave there's manydifferent ways I could take this conversation, but I want to kind of build fromfoundations now and then go into effects because you did mention there thatbeta waves were not necessarily affected through the thalamus, but I am curioushow you affect them with audio visual and treatment, but we'll come to thathere in a sec.

Um, audio, visual and treatment. If we're going to build thebasics for people, I know you've kind of hinted at it already. But what issomebody experiencing when they sign themselves up to this or get one of thesedevices?

[00:19:55] Dave: Well, I can I'll explain maybe whatyou'll experience on a physiological level and maybe on a psychological level.

So we've, we're

[00:20:02] Boomer: putting on the glasses though, andwe're, we're hooking ourselves up to some sort of sound, um, just to kind

[00:20:10] Dave: of give people a backdrop. Yeah. Sowe've done a few things since the original research was done. Now we do fieldstimulation as you notice with your glasses, so we can do a different frequencykind of in each side of the brain, although it's a lot weaker than full visualfield of stimulation. And we've also randomized the pulses as, so everything israndomized. Some not too much. We can randomize roughly that's the, if you weredoing 10 Hertz, we can randomize them up to plus minus one. So maybe nine to11. But if you start to go further, it completely doesn't work.

But if you randomize the entrainment, mildly the effects on thebrain and the psyche are a great deal better than a fixed frequency. So as westart to make more sideways, which you don't, and we start to re split thefields, and now we're randomizing it on an EEG. You don't see much of asignature anymore.

It's it's sometimes you don't see the signature at all. We usedSMR beta, so. To generate alpha, especially in people with brain injuries. Thatis the most effective thing we've used to generate alpha. Uh, Tom Bazinsky useda whole variety of frequencies from eight Hertz to 22 to re-establish alpha inan Alzheimer's patient and had complete, complete recovery.

Uh, with this lady, uh, she moved out of the senior someone andback into her own. Uh, and, and live. And we could walk down through downtownSeattle and not get lost again and, and had a normal walk and ever hadcompleted the normal life. After being, after being, uh, written off to bedead, they thought she was going to be dead within six months and she returnedto a completely normal life using a treatment that was randomized between eightand 22, but fixed frequencies, but up and down and all over the place, butmaybe not 20, 30 seconds at a shot at each fixed frequency.

So we just started the randomizing on the fly up to plus minusone Hertz. And it significantly enhanced the effect of a fixed frequency. Ifyou went plus minus two and there about the same, if you went plus minus threeand it didn't work at all. So, so even though you still need to have, you needto hold the frequency to some degree, like I would say your center or your basefrequency randomizing, it, uh, makes it a whole lot better.

It's not, is it really entrainment? Now it's getting hard totell. Cause you don't see a very strong signature on an EEG anymore. Oh, that'sstill see a little beta here, a little SMR there, a little alpha there, but forthe most part, we don't see too much. Also flashing lights really drives up cerebralblood flow.

Flashing lights really drives a Pete shock protein, which isan, a very important chemical in our bodies for fighting pathogens likebacteria and viruses. Very important in the brain, uh, for, uh,post-inflammatory issues. Uh, keeping the brain settled down, fightinginflammation, attacking a cancer, uh post-hoc or heat shock protein, reallyattacks cancer.

Uh, it also drives it lactate and ATP. And the one study showed260% increase in five minutes of entrainment or lactate and ATP. Also theassociates people, and the more see when we randomize it, people just driftinto a trance way deeper than it was when it was a fixed frequency. And, uh, soall these other aspects of entrainment and now cytokines all the researchcoming out on cytokines, showing that that flashing lights really drives upnon-inflammatory cytokines, which is all tied into microglia activity, thebrain's own immune system, its ability to clean up trash or garbage from thebrain.

So a lot of things happen from light, just being light,regardless of the frequency so much. So even though we're still calling itaudio visual entrainment, we're kind of getting, and we can't call it audiovisual stimulation because I mean, watching TV as audio, visual stimulation, orsitting on the curb, watching the traffic go by, but that's not going to giveyou any neurological benefits.

So there needs to be another term right now I'm calling itrandomized audio, visual and training. That's the best I've got or, or rave.

[00:24:28] Boomer: As well, that's terrible that youreferenced earlier

[00:24:30] Dave: too. We're already real raving about itnow, the randomisation and I think that's probably the best definition at themoment is randomized or divisionally treatment within the definition.

That's not too right. It's still in training. It's randomizing,but it's still in training and there's kind of this perfect blend between thetwo that works so well. And, uh, uh, and I've got now studies after 20 yearslooking at add depression, anxiety, uh, cognitive decline and seniors collegestudents in grade point, average worry, um, all of these things.

Then now the ERP is only book related potentials. And allshowing that when we mild the randomize, it, the effects are somewhat better.They're less depressed and less anxious. Their grades are better. Their don'tworry as much. They sleep better than if it's a fixed frequency. So anyway, towrap up this definition, uh, it's much, much more complex than just all yourvisual entrainment now.

And even at that, the electrical brainwave side of it, becauseeverybody calls, what frequency should you use for this? What frequencies thatI use for that? I go.

Yeah, it's not really a frequency thing that much anymore. It'spurely a dissociative thing. Cause when you dissociate, the dissociating reallybreaks the HPA axis of the hypothalamic pituitary adrenal axis flight or fightaxis. And almost everybody nowadays who's struggling, especially if you'restruggling emotionally or cognitively, you're really high on the flight orfight end.

The adrenals are cranking out stuff. You know, cortisol is highepinephrine and norepinephrine are high and this just breaks it like cuttingthrough butter with a hot knife. And that is one of the healing aspects ofrandomized. Uh, or I call it re. Randomized audio, visual and treatment is abreaks. This whole process that really kills us much more than the actual issuewe're dealing with.

It's brutal. So just getting that happening, which happens veryfast, 10, 15 minutes. We just see that whole HPA axis crash. If people getincredibly relaxed breathing, a slow deep like heart rate variability, theelectric thermal falls off muscles relax, uh, F when you hook someone up tobiofeedback, you see a massive, uh, really beneficial things that are mimickingextremely deep meditation occur in minutes, usually 10 minutes, most of thetime.

And so, anyway,

[00:27:03] Boomer: that's sort of similar to what I havefrom personal experience. Now, I guess the sound, is it also randomized aswell? Because when I'm doing it, I have obviously, um, sort of a beat goinginto my ears. Is that also randomized within the process? Or how does it syncto light? I try to consume about a book a week and that's normal reading, butthere's countless numbers of business.

Self-help spiritual books that I want to get to, but don'treally have the time. And most of these books really with the exception of thatspirituality category are really only worth about two paragraphs ofinformation. The folks of Blinkus solve this issue for me of just too manybooks with too little time by really condensing a lot of information into cliffnotes.

You remember those from back in high school when you didn'treally want to read something. And what they've done is they've made it into 20pages of information and key takeaway. So I use Blinkist every single day. Itallows me to consume at least one book a day, and then some days I get muchmore done.

So if you want to try it head on over to the show notes forthis episode and we'll link to Blinkist for you, and you can really try thatone out for yourself and just become an Uber mench when it comes toinformation.

[00:28:26] Dave: Yes, it sinked to though it'sscintillate the left ear sink to the left fields, the eyes and the right to theright fields.

You notice when you're hearing the sound will go up, up, up,up, up, it's not consistent. And, and that's the randomization.

[00:28:42] Boomer: Uh, and that randomization changesfrom time to time when I'm using this device,

[00:28:46] Dave: uh, every single time. Cause we don'twant habituation every single time we play it. The randomizing is changed.

Every six. I am the right side is different than the left side.Even if I'm playing a fixed frequency, let's say like alpha 10 Hertz. Generallywe will split them off by about 0.3 Hertz. So you get this

kind of an effect as to go in and out of phase and that alonejust knocks you out. You just can't get through it


[00:29:15] Boomer: You said a term there that I'm alittle on familiar with in and out of phase. What are you referring to there?

[00:29:21] Dave: Well, face could be that say where thelights are. The tones are all pulsing together, pop up left and right sides ofbup, bup, bup, bup, bup, bup, bup.

you know, even though they're at 10 Hertz at say on the leftside and 10 it's on the right side, if they're back and forth, you kind of hear20, right. And that, and when they're going in and out of that kind of phase,it can just, um, people just drift into a trance, uh, very, very quickly. Andthat's the hard part of the healing process.

Plus for Exodus we're suspecting. The all the combinations andpermutations of this mass of latencies between the stimuli is also anotherfactor in boosting brain, brain performance, and also improving relaxationbecause it's no longer just fixed in time. It's all over the place. And it'svery overwhelming, right?

[00:30:13] Boomer: Uh, one of the things that youmentioned and particularly this audience is, um, susceptible to that, uh,overuse of the HPA accesses speak, uh, you know, people that, and I think thisis general with anybody who has, uh, any level of ambition or stress in theirlife is, uh, you just generally, overclock your adrenals get stressed, leads toinsomnia, et cetera.

Can we take them through how we would use this device for theseparticular situations? Because I find, look, I picked up very candidly. Ipicked up the device before. Uh, stress is something that I always have to dealwith. And, you know, as an entrepreneur, it doesn't really stop. And so it'sbeen very, very therapeutic for me in that sense, but I would love to hear justsort of how you would take somebody if you were to, obviously I'm doing thisremotely, but if you were to sort of work with them and use this device forlet's call it severe angle.

[00:31:18] Dave: Yeah. And it depends on the kind ofanxiety I've been brain mapping for

[00:31:22] Boomer: 30 years. Yeah. So you could probablydefine that a lot more than I can.

[00:31:26] Dave: Well, I've come across five types. Uh,so far, uh, all the five types of anxiety, there's psychological anxiety andthere's slow brain anxiety. When you've, when all that cortisol finally slowsthe brain down.

Or if you have bad nutrition or even a low thyroid from maybe Idine malabsorption or nine to five dine in your diet. Or cortisol depletionfrom being too stressed, too long, the brain will start to slow down. And whenthe brain starts to slow down, it loses its brakes. It takes energy to put onthe brakes.

And, uh, so, so there's, there's this in a way kind of twobasic types of anxiety that are neurological one, it's too much gas, the foot'son the gas and just flying everywhere. And then there's the type where youfinally get exhausted and you really don't have hardly any. Per se, but thebreak guy is also can't put on the brakes anymore.

And so your brain is racing all the time with no thought thatis worthwhile. When you have your foot on the gas, you're thinking all kinds ofstuff relating to your work, global warming, I don't energy crisis engineeringprojects or whatever. But when you start to get exhausted, your brain justraces about nothing worthwhile most of the time and you can't turn it off.

So there's a no brakes type, which is slow. And, uh, and thenthere's the faster types and the faster types, there's a couple or three ofthem. There's also an obsessive compulsive type. There's also depressed,anxious type a, which often happens. And then there's just plain old,psychological anxiety. I mean, man, um, just be at the airport as you know, andyou got, and you're trying to, you know, meet timelines and stuff.

Then you look up and you see the screen that says flightdelayed. That's a spike. If you had an M, if you had biofeedback monitors onyour, just watch yourself go. Other forms of psychological anxiety are the waywe push ourselves nowadays with so extremely hard. You know, if you have, ifyou buffer two hours a day, For just spare time and you wake up in the morning,uh, your kids have got a bit of a problem.

They're fussing with something or other, and it takes you anextra 10 minutes to get them out the door. No worries. You still got an hour or50 left. Then they get stuck in traffic and then there's a train. Maybe thenthere's something else, you know, and you got a delay here, a delay there,delay there, a delay there.

But after the course of the day, maybe you've had an hour ofdelays and you still had an hour buffer. So you relaxed a bit during that hourand you didn't have really much. Maybe 5% increased stress from those delays inyour day. But what happens now, if you're delayed is so tightly, so tightlypacked and I've been there that you don't have 10 minutes to spare.

What happens when that child delays you? By 10 minutes, rightoff the bat, you're freaking out. Joanne is starting to get the hell out

[00:34:25] Boomer: of my life five years

[00:34:26] Dave: ago. Okay. It's brutal. So there's anexponential curve to how much spare time we have in our day and all this stuffthat is pushing us, pushing us, do more, do more, do more is killing us becauseit becomes exponential.

We, and, and we don't keep that in context, we say, oh, what agreat week? Let's do a motivational speaker or something. Oh, we can do this.Sure. Off we go. And we forget that. The brain state run. Now it's a carry overfrom the state we've been in for the last few months. Now, suddenly we'repushing ourselves to do this great project or get onboard this new company ordo some amazing things.

But riding on that relaxation from the last few months, and nowwe're pushing ourselves and the stress slowly climbs as we start to burn as westart to burn and we don't feel it because it's not fast. And after about two months,you know, three, four months in maybe six months in, you know, we're just onedge.

We can't sleep well. We're popping sleeping pills. We'reyelling at our spouse or yelling at our kids and, and life is slowly startingto come apart. Then we have all those added stresses cause we can't react. Wecan't relate socially when we're under stress, especially guys, women do betterunder mild, under moderate stress actually relate better socially, but guysbecome solitary under moderate stress.

And so we, then we start to feel lonely and then depressed andthen this and that. And then maybe our marriage is breaking up or we're havingall kinds of other thoughts of leaving our spouse or something like this. Andthen everything just gets messier and messier then with, and then there's allthese compounding effects from our lives on, on what's the word unwinding kindof in front of her eyes.

And, uh, and it gets extremely messy and then there's a bigcrash. And then we have a reality check and we have to do it to do a seriouscheckup from the neck up. And because now we're in a mess and now we're just onsurvival mode. But at that point we've burned our adrenals. We've depleted ournorepinephrine in our brain.

We've uh, oh all or maybe the, uh, oh, the cytokines that arewild and microglia are going wild. And, and now it could take years to recoverfrom that. Whereas if we just controlled it in the first place, uh, we wouldn'thave been there. So in Tremont does two things that are really nice. One of thethings is, is that when we in train, the effect typically is so profound.

You get so deeply relaxed, especially if you've been caught upin the stress world for a long time and you no longer know you're actuallystressed because you're so used to it. And then you go on this on a train andit goes into go like bang. And you're like, holy cow. That's what it means tobe relaxed.

Oh my God. I forgot what that felt like that often gives peoplea bit of a reality check to start changing their lifestyle and start gettingbetter. But also by having a treatment, you really do reset those adrenals verywell. And you reset the brain very well. And the neurotransmitters likeserotonin goes up, endorphins, go up, you'll start to sleep better.

Uh, but also you will think more efficiently because you justcannot process under flight or fight a tall well, and so you'll start to dothings more efficiently in less time and start now having more time on yourlife. And you'll be making better choices, especially emotional choices,because you're more level now.

So you're not doing crazy dopamine seeking choices, which arealways dangerous. And, uh, And as long as you re respect that extra time youget for being for functioning more efficiently and better. And you don't try tofill that void because I get people to comment. If they say I'm working like a12 hour day, and I want to work 16, but your machine do that.

And I'm like, I don't want to sell you my device. Cause I don'twant you working a 16 hour day and using our gear to do that. I want you torecognize that 12 hours is plenty good. And if you can pick that 12 and knockit into 10, because you're more efficient, that's what I want you to do,because I want you to spend time with the things that are important in life.

Like your friends and your family and your. I don't want you tofeel that two hour void now with something else and fill it back up again andjust keep, keep burning out all the way down. Uh, cause , can't save you from acrazy reckless lifestyle. It can, it can slow it down, but you will crash andburn.

Anyway, if you don't respect

[00:38:52] Boomer: it, I want to come back to thatlifestyle standpoint. We're going to come back to that because I think thereare some things that people need to consider before engaging with this, butalso engaging with any technology you and I talked about this before we hit record,but on with the device, there's numerous settings.

Cause I have the delight pro uh, I believe it's the Daviddelight pro and there's numerous settings that I can choose from. And there'simages that I can choose, um, when I'm doing in treatment and let's, we cantake stress as an example, which of these settings should I use? Should I usethem all? Should I avoid.

And like for instance, is it, is it okay to play around witheverything or should I go very directed at one type of in treatment?

[00:39:43] Dave: You know, uh, I officially, like in theold days, I would have definitely said, use this frequency and use Africansaying, use this thing. See, um, now I say use whatever works because it'sdifferent for everybody.

We still general trends that follow, you know, sort of theneuroscience and EEG and brainwaves and stuff. But these are trends. They'renot absolutes and everybody will break the trends. You know, we'll say, well,you should use this for your depression, or you should use that for whateverelse or user alpha for your anxiety.

And they'll use something completely different and, and theywill benefit greatly. So I always say, uh, I will give you maybe a, uh, atypical give our customers a suggestion of where they should start and thenencourage them to experiment some too. You can't hurt yourself with entrainmentand. And you just never know what's going to happen.

Like some of the disorders that people have are hypothalamicand we have a hypothalamic protocol lender and the feeling better section, Ithink it's number four and it's like half Hertz to one Hertz. It's so slow.It's like on, off, on off, you know, it's very, very boating and yethypothalamic really, it really has an impact.

And it's been used for fibromyalgia, for hypertension and, uh,and other ailments that people have. And it works very, very well on a smallgroup of people. Like 10% of the users will find that that sub Delta session isreally powerful. Otherwise it's not going to work, um, for most other people,but the more anxious and wound a person is the less likely something like alphais going to work.

Everybody thinks will alpha that's that's meditation. But, uh,no, if you are like so intense, You're watching the pulses. If I said somethingto do with just watching the pulses flashed in your eyes and you're countingthem practically, uh, it is not going to work for you. And then that's whenit's time to go to dual frequency stimulation or faster, at least spike SMR oralpha beta.

And we typically go to alpha beta for depression. Becausealmost always under stress, the left hemisphere. Well, I shouldn't say almostalways, always the left hemisphere gives up first. It's more sensitive tocortisol and neurotransmitters that are stress-based and the left hemispherestarts to pack it in first.

And that's the classic sign of alpha asymmetry. Depression ismore alpha waves in the left side, which is the happy side. And then there ison the right side. And so if the right side has less alpha than the left, youhave depression because the fear site is more turned on cause alphas and Ithink rhythm.

So the more alpha you have that means the less active that partof the brain is so high, alpha, alpha on the left side means it's just notrunning that well. And the fear sides in control. So the depression protocol.Uh, when people have severe stress, that's almost always the first thing I sayto go-to is that alpha beta helps to pick up the mood.

A lot of emotional stuff swings in that left hemisphere. Isn'tworking so well. And it's the first to go. So, and it also is verydissociating. So when you run the, the, um, the happy face, number one, ornumber two, the number two has an alpha front end on it for about 12 minutes.That's my favorite one. Uh, it'll just knock you out and you'll just wake upfeeling better, sharper and more relaxed and happier.

And if you're more, if you perceive your day to be better,because they're in a happier frame of mind, you have less stress risks. Uh,Kane did a study looking at just that, this, uh, and what he looked at was helooked to the right alpha and subtracted, the left alpha. So if the left off ofcourse is larger than the right, that's the sign of depression.

So if he had a negative number, if you had 10 microvolts herein 15 here, that gives you minus five microvolts. But if it was reversed, causeyou were extremely happy and you had 10 microvolts here, or you had 15microvolts on the right and 10 on the left, that would be a positive number offive. Well, he found that if you had a positive number versus a negativenumber, those are the negative number, perceived life.

Even if they're exact same situation as the positive number,they perceive life to be a whole lot worse because they had a negative outlook becausethe fear side was activated much more than the happy side was. So, and if youhave a negative outlook on life, everything is going to seem to be crappierthan it actually is.

So just. Feeling happier, you're going to, you're going to haveless stress as a result of it. But another cool thing is that he found thatwhen they had a negative number, so basically depressed outlook or a negativeoutlook on life, it compromised their natural killer cell activity by 40%. Sothat means they were more prone to infections and viral viruses, colds, flus,and all of that.

[00:44:34] Boomer: And that makes sense with depressionand immunosuppression. Right. That makes complete sense. Interesting. Um, with,I guess, a few things here and I have to ask this question, although I don'tfully, uh, this is coming from an audience member, uh, but gamma, uh, those whowant to access gamma waves because of what they've read about advancedmeditators, et cetera, can we do this with the audio visual and treatment, oris it something that is kind of TBD in the future?

The decoding superhuman podcast is a part of the healthoptimization network of podcasts, health optimization, network of podcastssupports health optimization, medicine and practice a 5 0 1 C3 nonprofit athealth optimization, medicine and practice. What we hope to do is educatedoctors and practitioners on how to optimize for health rather than treatdisease.

If you wanted to find out more about it, yourself, head on overto home, and learn about things like chronobiology exposomics by ourenergetics or even metabolomics, check it out, home,

[00:45:48] Dave: You know, it's it's. Now we have in ourdevices now in the delight pluses and pros it's in our device, those devicesnow, uh, having said that there's a lot of hype on gamma that isn't very backedup.

Okay. I want to hear more. So just be wary of that.Unfortunately, uh, there is a group, uh, headed up by the professor. Her nameis T Sai Sai and they did a, an Alzheimer's study, kind of an Alzheimer's studyon transgenic mice, all who were designed genetically to make a lot of plaquesin their brain. And when they gave them gamma, they had 60% reductions inplaques, uh, same day.

Wow. So it was absolutely remarkable and they patented their stuff.They publicized it everywhere. They published all their research, trying tobecome rich and famous. And, uh, which, I mean, I don't begrudge anybody beingrich and famous, but sometimes the money gets ahead of the logic and thescience. And so they made this logic leap that if it worked on transgenic mice,of course, it's going to work on all humans, but humans don't get all simersbecause we're, transgenically modified.

And so when a real study was done in Alzheimer's using gamma at40 Hertz fixed 40 Hertz, it didn't work. So, uh, but the hype nonetheless was,so the train was rolling and the hypest kept on going and going and going. Andpeople still ask me about it all the time. And I go, no, it's really not astudy. You can use, uh, that being said though, uh, singer and her group didsome fairy, uh, well, well, well designed studies or certainly one bigwell-designed study on wild mice, which are not transgenic and more likely tobe more like humans looking at cytokines.

And there's a lot of research emerging on cytokines and howthey affect the brain, how they affect microglia. Microglia can either protectourselves or destroys them, depends on the kind of signaling that cytokinesthat microglia get. They're kind of like the killer cells in our. And they takeout the trash to keep it clean.

And they also they're, they're the big immune protector, like,you know, like T killer cells are and when they get the wrong signaling, whichcan be caused by stress, uh, that's a big word. Uh, long-term chronic stresscauses a lot of improper signaling viruses and bacteria can do it too. Uh, butstress is a big one and then they get, they get the wrong signaling and thenthey will actually attack neurons and destroy them.

And so many of our people who've been post-inflammatoryconditions either from viruses or from concussions and stuff. They can't thinkthey can't process. Um, they're flat-lined EEG. Wow. Flat line, really badphase, meaning that the transmission times are very slow and usually in onedirection, sometimes both and, um, and their, their fellow misses disconnectedfrom their, from their oscillators.

So they can't make alpha waves. They can't make Delta waves, sothey can't sleep. They all have severe anxiety. They'll have some really severeinsomnia and they're all obsessive compulsive. So they're hoarders counters,cutters, ritualists anorexics and committed substance abusers. And they allhave the same signature of which is what's wild.

And I've been documenting this for the longest time. I have a90 minute video on YouTube and you can get it off our website, explaining allabout how this works, but now I want to get ahold of the cytokine researchers.Cause I have a feeling that there's going to be a real big connection betweenthe cytokines being generated, the cytokines that make microglia go wild andhow the whole thing is playing out in our low voltage, no alpha EEG that we'rerecording on these people.

Yeah. You'll see examples on, on our, on, on that video, uh,flatline people and they're, so they're OCD, they're severe anxiety. They can'tfunction. And in 15 minutes suddenly there'll be an alpha spindle will kick andthen another one and then another one, then more channels we'll startrecruiting. And when that session is over, They're like, wow.

The bags off my head, I can think clearly, uh, I've had somewonderful stories. Uh, we helped a guy who was, uh, a binge alcoholic all hislife, you know, or not all his life. So he's a binge I'll call. You was 31. Hewas just the deadbeat, never got any education, never got a trade and he's adrunk and he's blessed his license to drive three times.

And now he's banned from driving and a and a friend sent him downto get a brain map done and I mapped him and he's just the most flat guy I'veever seen. And he can't have this guy can have a relationship either, you know,and he lives in a basement suite of a friend's house for a few hundred bucks amonth.

And he just does odd jobs, you know, hauling furniture forpeople, if they're moving or some things like this, just to make enough moneyfor some food and alcohol. And, uh, and I mapped them and I said, well, you'rethe most concussed guy I have ever seen, but this is not a metal. This is not astructural concussion.

Most of the concuss people, I look at pass an MRI, they don'tsee any scar tissue. It's a metabolic shutdown. That's post-inflammatory andI'm calling it a thalamic cortical disconnect and cause there's, that's youralpha waves and Delta waves from a, it's a loop between the thalamus and thecortex.

That's what I'm calling it. A disconnect between theethological cortical disconnect. Uh, so anyway, and I said, you've had a verysevere concussion or a viral infection or something, but you've had severeinflammation and he goes, oh yeah, I forgot when I was six, I fell off a slideand I punctured my right sculp, a whole inch.

Wow. Crushed a whole inch. Yeah, two and a half centimeters foreverybody else. Uh, yeah. And hit and hit, shut his brain down. He was on the,he was actually on the news because in the little town he grew up in, he wasthe first person to use the air vac. They had the air vacuum with a chopper,uh, get them into the city where they could do surgery on his brain.

And the doctor said, wow, we're lucky. He didn't get a braininjury. He was this close. No, he was shut down for the next 25 years. And, andwe fired and, um, we fired him up and in 15 minutes, cranking up giant alphawaves, but we're using randomized SMR. And that's it. So is that entrainmentnot really, uh, might be, might be randomized and training, but it's not atreatment per se because we're not getting the frequency that we put in alphadoesn't work very well at regenerating alpha and those types of people, youneed to hit them hard with fast, complex stimulation to fire up those circuitsagain.

Anyway, fired him up. He quit drinking, uh, two months laterand he just sent me his award and he's three months sober. He's now working asa machinist. He's got his life together, had another lady who is 20 yearspostcard. And, um, she, uh, sent me this beautiful letter. She just shuffledaround her house for 20 years.

Fortunately, her husband didn't believe her because often yousplit your marriage marriages break up. When someone has a brain injury likethat shuffled around your house for 20 years, then a distributor of ours gother on a treatment. Three months later, she enrolled in college and she sent methis beautiful letter, thanking me for her PhD.

Oh, it was wonderful. And I get another lady who got hermaster's after she was five years, post car accident couldn't do anything. Herhouse was a disaster couldn't work. And five years later now she's working onyour masters. We got her fired up again. Usually, usually they'll fire up thesame session, but it's not because we're working on the neurons.

It's because we're working on the Gloria, probably the lactate,the ATP was all shut down and inflammatory and inflammation of the brain. Uh,the microglia that goes wild and all these other things that happen. And soeven though that original study on the transgenic mice with the plaques, wasn'treally the correct way to do it for humans.

It still showed that flashing lights could have an absolutelyincredible impact on. Parts of the brain that we typically don't really lookat, which are the glio astrocytes microglia oligodendrocytes and things likethis. That's what they don't work. The brain doesn't work period. The neuronsdon't work without the Gloria working for them first.

And one of the things about the sleep, like all these people,including football players, hockey players, who've been concussed. Chronictraumatic encephalopathy. That's the same thing that I can tell to me. Itlooks, it's exactly the same thing as Alzheimer's the signature is the same.And what happens is, is that they can't sleep because they've lost theirability to make large sleep Delta waves.

And so astrocytes must see large Delta waves to activatethemselves to clean up and dumped and, and, and dig the proteins that havebuilt up during the day and flush them into the lymphatic system in the brain.It's called the glymphatic system for Gloria lymphatic and flush it out. Soonce people get into this flat line, low voltage, no alpha type state, what I'mcalling say, a film, a cortical disconnect, their brains, fill up with protein.

And in five to 10 years, they're going to have eitherAlzheimer's or CTE. But a lot of that is because, because of the insomnia thatoccurs after those oscillators shut down. Yeah,

[00:55:12] Boomer: this is incredible. Imagine that yourphone is pretty busy given all the recent discussions around CTE, especially insports

[00:55:20] Dave: and, uh, not too much yet.

We're still working on it, but I'm working with a lady namedBecky Basham. You might want to interview her. She started the sports recoveryclinic in California, and she's been seeing, um, oh, dozens and dozens of maybeshe's up around a hundred now, but all NFL football players who lost theircareers, lost their homes, lost their families, everything.

And there are, some of them are living in the streets as aresult of concussions from playing football and she's using our gear to firethem back up. Good.

[00:55:52] Boomer: That's um, that's wonderful to hearnow, Dave, for the average person, I apologize to just move this on because Icould pick your brain about success stories all day long.

Uh, but for the average person who picks up one of yourdevices, What does the practice, the day-to-day look like within treatment? Isit a once a day thing, a few times a week? How frequently, how often should aperson use

[00:56:16] Dave: it? I think it depends where you are.Uh, you know, for me, I still use entrainment on occasion.

I think I function. I think I'm pretty sharp yet. I'm doingquite well, but I definitely there's days maybe I didn't sleep well, or I'mjust, my head is in a bit of a muddle and I have to write a couple of bookchapters and, uh, certainly, uh, uh, running some interim. We're really helpsget my head in gear to, uh, to get writing and get my thoughts organized.

And so on. Some people have used it up to three times a day,like fibromyalgia. It's pretty common for them to use it three times a day. Uh,other students and things, uh, ADHD kids often benefit best, especially ifthey're kind of oppositional defiant, but in general, ADHD, kids work best bythe parents putting it on in the morning while they're still sleeping, theydon't have to be awake to use it and they will just wake up and there'll beorganized.

There'll be together. They won't be emotional. They won't befighting with everybody. And so, yeah, putting on a half an hour before theywake up has been probably the best way to use the treatment for kids strugglingwith emotional issues, add ADHD, learning disabilities, and so on. Really getsthem going.

So it can depend on what you want to do. If you want to, if youhave kind of a job, let's say you're working a night shift or you want to goout Saturday night and you want to really party hard, well, run a nice humansession at eight o'clock at night. And, and man, that'll fire you up and youcan, you can dance till three o'clock in the morning.

[00:57:50] Boomer: Uh, I may have to remember that onefor when Amsterdam dance event happens.

[00:57:55] Dave: Yes, indeed. So, uh, and some peoplewill use it in the afternoon for anxiety, but it is different. Everybody is sounique and their situation in life is so unique. And so they have to do thosework arounds and see when it's going to work best for them.

[00:58:10] Boomer: Any issue with closing eyes during it,

[00:58:14] Dave: we should close your eyes. You shouldalways close your eyes. Okay. You mean you can use it eyes open. It won't hurtyou, but the effect is somewhat better. If your eyes are closed. Okay. Yeah,you have a better visual, a larger visual field that's exposed with. So you cantrain or you stimulate more neurons.

And when your eyes are close to your you'll dissociate betterand shift into that trance more effectively.

[00:58:36] Boomer: Beautiful. Uh, Dave, one of the thingsthat you and I chatted about beforehand was this idea of checking boxes andreally trying to understand yourself a little bit more. And there's certainthings that people should be doing, uh, either while using one of thesetechnologies or even getting one of these technology.

What are sort of the basics that you think people

[00:58:57] Dave: need to get a true. Now, one of thethings I always say is you should always, every day we should do a checkup fromthe neck up, but don't do it in an obsessive compulsive way. That is nothealthy. Yeah. Uh, just do it and then analytical, how am I doing today?

Kind of thing. But yes. So basically, uh, I mean the brain islike a Ferrari, it's a high performance. And it needs good inputs. And when Isay good inputs, I'm talking fuel lifestyle, uh, events, um, uh, how we eat,what we think inputs is an input to our brain, but certainly on the nutritionalside, there's all kinds of things that affect the brain.

I've come to believe now, after working with the brain for 30years, that 80% of brain function, it's all based on what's going into thebrain. And especially on the nutritional side, I've seen so many thingsrecently had the boy who became ADHD and oppositional defiance and learningdisabled. And the mum was south side of the mom about it.

This is just back in like February or so. And so talking aboutthe kid's diet and everything else, cause I'll get into that in a bit. Well, itturns out he, the boy became a vegetarian and I said, I bet you he's deficientin iron. And man, if you don't get oxygen to your brain, how can you function?And sure enough, he was unreadable practically and iron deficiency.

It was that bad. So they got him on iron and almost all of hisissues have been resolved. So that's one example of other deficiencies,magnesium, selenium, copper, uh, I mean this whole list of minerals that weneed. There's new nutrients that we need. And then there's stuff we shouldn'thave probably when the brain starts.

Go, whether it's from street overs, from stressing it too much,uh, bad lifestyle choices or bad nutrition, the brain starts to slow, or wecan, we can do a bunch of weird things, but typically sleep gets compromisedand then we're tired and then we're not functioning well. And then we want tocrave carbs because craving carbs will typically spike the brain with a littleserotonin because we lose serotonin so easily.

When we don't, when our brain isn't functioning well, it goesinto fight or fight. It goes, oh my God, something's off, something's off. Andit goes in. And the first sign of fight or flight is to suppress serotoninbecause if we're being attacked by a wild animal, that's. If we're high inserotonin, we're just going to get eaten.

The serotonin must be suppressed so we can get vigilant andready to fight. Serotonin is relaxing. You can't be in flight or fight. Youcan't defend yourself physically or, or in any fashion. Really. If you're toorelaxed and in a flight or fight capacity where you actually have to physicallyget your fist going and start pounding on something, you can't have serotoninin your system.

So the brain has learned, the brain can shut off serotonin intwo seconds, if it perceives a threat. So when it starts to perceive a threat,serotonin starts to go down and our preference starts to go up. Then we haveinsomnia. Then we have anxiety. Then we're tired all the time. Then we startcraving donuts and carrot cake and yummy

[01:01:55] Boomer: stuff.

You know, I mean, in your neck of the woods, is it Tim Horton'sor is Tim Horton's more on the other side of the country?

[01:02:01] Dave: I know. Yeah. It's Tim Horton's is a bigthing up here. Okay.

[01:02:04] Boomer: So that's what people going to do.Morton's right.

[01:02:07] Dave: Uh, yeah, they go for the coffee and thedonut, right? So a little bit of caffeine to get the Northern effort.

Not that they need it, but just so tired in the morning, theytried to need that kick. Maybe we function, well, we don't need coffee and wedon't need a donut. So, uh, so they spike their spiking insulin. And when youspike insulin, it gives a perception of having higher serotonin. So we feelbetter, but also high sugar like that refined sugar also spikes in the brainhelps to perk up a little bit too.

Uh, and so people start to crave junk like that. Of course,then there's all the backend problems that happen when we crave junk. And, uh,and one is, you know, Putting on weight, you start feeling sluggish and thenthey start, they quit running. If they're, if you're into fitness, cause nowthey're getting dumpy and they're just tired now because this gives them ashort perk or burst and then it's gone and then they have all the self-imageissues and their overall health issues.

And that starts declining. And when we exercise and work outless cerebral blood flow goes down, visceral spiral. Oh, it's a terrible spot.Either. Respiring up or we're spiraling down. We don't, we don't often staylevel. And then so much processed food is, is full of, uh, it's not organic andit's full of glyphosate, which is Roundup and it's full of other pesticides perchlorate.

And these are all neurotoxins and that starts affecting ourbrain too. So we really start to lose it and we start putting all kinds ofgarbage into the Ferrari's engine. Uh, and then the Ferrari just cannot run.And as an example of a real Ferrari engine, if you threw a little care, CNN, alittle, a little bit of dirt, maybe a little sugar, a little fertilizer.

Uh, diesel, uh, you can never tune up that Ferrari, no matterwhat you do,

[01:03:51] Boomer: you're not going to do formula onewith that.

[01:03:55] Dave: You're just barely dive down, drive downthe street with that. Yeah. And so the brain is the same way. So I say topeople before you get into brain technologies, cause the brain technology likeentrainment mid drives the brain pretty hard.

You want that brain functional. You don't want to just, youdon't want to make a Volkswagen, pull a semi-trailer you're just gonna, justgoing to blow off the transmission and kill the engine probably. Uh, so startgetting your diet in order. Start looking at your lifestyle. Are you working 16hour days?

Are you having any fun at all? Always remind yourself that.Well, my work is so much fun that I can pretty much do my work, you know, 16hours a day. If I wanted to, although I do, I still make sure I take myweekends off and have fun with the family and get work away. Even though I loveit so much, but for most people don't love their work as much as I have time.

And which is kinda more like play sometimes than it is work.Uh, cause I get it's exciting, but work is something to do so you can makemoney so you can have a real life when you go home at five o'clock. So when yougo have a five, o'clock have your real life, the money helped you spend, payyour rent, have utilities, buy food and hang out with your family, yourfriends, and take care of your health.

Do those things first. And then consider getting into braintechnology, pass your functionality, which is always good, but don't use it asthis sort of fixed to push yourself harder and push yourself harder. I mean,having said that a lot of athletes use our gear and we've certainly with quitea few others, some very high profile athletes.

We're going to push themselves ridiculously hard, no matter

perform better, get through their day, not burn out as fast andso on, but for the average person, you know, and unless you've got that bar seton these giant ideals, just don't push yourself to that point where you'recraving carbs or eating junk, you're burning up and your brain functionality.And you're losing your, your relationship with yourself, with your friends,with your loved ones playing off the same.

Who's uh, who I climb and cave with and the young guy he's inhis thirties and he decided to get his masters in one year only fund a sprint,well, six months and all the CBD and THC, he was doing this burned out and hiswife all these years, then he was getting out on wound and.

And, and then I could tell his voice was higher pitched now.Cause he was so tense in the vocal chords. And yet he had a tremor in hisvoice. I had a hard time talking to him and keeping him on topic as his brainwas scattered all over. And uh, and so now that he's, we just had a wonderfulhanging out him and I about two weeks ago, it's been like six months since allthe sort of the shit has gone by the wayside.

And he says, now looking back, he said, oh my God was I erect.So I didn't know it. I said, that's the problem with stress. It's slowly,slowly climbs and humans don't notice slowly changing thing.

[01:07:16] Boomer: It's only when you're only when you'reknocked out for a few days that you kind of, or even worse. Right. I've beensent to the hospital before because I, I pushed a little too far, so

[01:07:28] Dave: absolutely I've done that too.

Several times. You can, things can be pretty stressful in therelaxation business. But, uh, yes, but you must learn to manage them. And thenthe gear will certainly enhance your life. You can even use the gear whileyou're going through all this stuff, but keep in mind, you still have toaddress that stuff.

If the machine starts making you feel real good, don't forget.You still have to go to plan a, which is look after your lifestyle, yournutrition, and, and your health and your relationships.

[01:07:58] Boomer: Dave, this has been an absolutepleasure. I know this is going to be the first of many conversations because Icontinue to use the device.

I continue to experiment with different aspects of the deviceand I continue to get good results. So it's an open invitation whenever youwant to come back on. But I would, I really appreciate you taking the timetoday to educate our audience about this really important technology.

[01:08:23] Dave: Thank you very much.

I appreciate, appreciate a boomer and I appreciate that you'vetaken interest in what we do. I, that, that means a lot to me too. Yes.

[01:08:32] Boomer: All right. Tell the superhumanslistening out there. We're going to throw this up on the YouTube channel aswell as everywhere else. Or you can get podcast, Dave, thank you again and havean absolutely excellent day.

[01:08:45] Dave: Thank you very much. I will do that.

[01:08:48] Boomer: The show notes for this slash . If you enjoyed this podcast, head on over toapple podcast and leave a five-star review. Every one of those reviews justbrings, oh, such a sweet smile to my face. If you're on YouTube, clicksubscribe. And if you want access to the show notes, advanced notice of guests,as well as the ability to ask questions to these guests, head on over todecoding and join the email list.

Finally, this show does not provide any sort of medical advice.I'm not a doctor. I don't pretend to be a doctor. And if you want a physicianor medical advice, it's probably best you go speak to a doctor. This is reallyjust sharing information and I hope you enjoy the sharing of that information.Thank you so much for your attention and having absolutely excellent day.

Dave SIever
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